Ouch!

[ssmith512]

Spirit of 76 just posted updated pricing on a lot of items. I am seeing 30%-50% price increases on the few items they are listing now. For example, Pro Line 9 shot Kamuro, now $246 for a case, I paid $166 5 months ago; Pro Line 36 shot RWB Peony, now $128 for a case, I paid $91 5 months ago. Man, if that kind of price increase remains, that is gonna put a hurt on a few shows.

UGH!!

[cduesman]

And I thought the prices from 5 months ago were too high.

Some of the NOABs have doubled in price since 2018.

Chris

[esgrillo]

I would not expect this to go down. If anything up. I do a lot of importing and shipping prices are insane right now and that is for non-hazardous items. Worse than earlier in the year. Ningbo was closed for 3 weeks in May due to the delta variant. That is creating a new layer of havoc in multiple ports now in China.

[Big Worm]

I stopped doing business with 76 about 2 years ago because of their prices. What I am currently seeing on their website is outrageous!

[mguerra]

$10 a shot for a NOAB. Glad I can shoot 1.3 3” shells!

[jamisonlm3]

It's official. Current wholesale pricing has caught up to retial pricing. Where is it going to end?

[mguerra]

Slices are through the roof. A fan cake is just a box of slices. If you made a cake out of 5 slices it would be over $100.00! I think I'm just going individually match rows of select fan cakes to use as slices this year. You don't get all the same effects but for crying out loud those slices are outrageous.

[Birdman]

Slices are through the roof. A fan cake is just a box of slices. If you made a cake out of 5 slices it would be over $100.00! I think I'm just going individually match rows of select fan cakes to use as slices this year. You don't get all the same effects but for crying out loud those slices are outrageous.

I noticed that too and had the same thought. I use to do that before I could get slices.

[Jay_]

I think that pretty much seals the deal for me.

I also noticed in the news that pretty much the entire Hunan province was under water due to the typhoon…I assume that will not help our cause either.

[Fox One]

One thing I've noticed over the years with any industry is that dramatic price increases work as long as the end consumer is willing to pay it. If consumers stop buying, then the prices will start falling. I am not going to pay ridiculous prices for fireworks, so I'll buy whatever I can find that is priced reasonably. And if nothing is priced reasonably, then I'll simply stop buying. This is merely a hobby. I'm not going to let high fireworks prices put me in a bind when it comes to the necessities of day to day living. I feel prices were already plenty high enough, especially when you consider we are essentially converting $$$ to noise to start with. So the folks who control the fireworks industry can go full retard if they wish. I'll just step aside until or unless things return to reasonable.

[Engineer Cat]

One thing I've noticed over the years with any industry is that dramatic price increases work as long as the end consumer is willing to pay it. If consumers stop buying, then the prices will start falling. I am not going to pay ridiculous prices for fireworks, so I'll buy whatever I can find that is priced reasonably. And if nothing is priced reasonably, then I'll simply stop buying. This is merely a hobby. I'm not going to let high fireworks prices put me in a bind when it comes to the necessities of day to day living. I feel prices were already plenty high enough, especially when you consider we are essentially converting $$$ to noise to start with. So the folks who control the fireworks industry can go full retard if they wish. I'll just step aside until or unless things return to reasonable.

I second that.

[Salutecake]

Let's not forget all the companies that are on the Glut Campaign! Bad weather in Texas causing Chicken wing and beef prices to soar - electronics soaring cause of chip shortages - I'm not disagreeing that there are not shortages on somethings, but come on. Chickens, they're in abundance in every state, beef - Florida's biggest crop, lumber, fireworks? Right now I think just about every business is on the glut wagon, if they can get away with charging an extra 10 to 30 percent without being charged by their states gouging laws.

I third above.

Years ago I bought Dave CD for my FEL, so as someone else pointed out, as long as the 1.3 prices remain somewhat stable I'll go there. Just looking at some of the prices.
So (plug for Dave) buy his cd get your FEL, join some local clubs, to learn, and shoot all year round at club events, see what it's like to shoot real 3" shells.

[Icooclast]

One thing I've noticed over the years with any industry is that dramatic price increases work as long as the end consumer is willing to pay it. If consumers stop buying, then the prices will start falling. I am not going to pay ridiculous prices for fireworks, so I'll buy whatever I can find that is priced reasonably. And if nothing is priced reasonably, then I'll simply stop buying. This is merely a hobby. I'm not going to let high fireworks prices put me in a bind when it comes to the necessities of day to day living. I feel prices were already plenty high enough, especially when you consider we are essentially converting $$$ to noise to start with. So the folks who control the fireworks industry can go full retard if they wish. I'll just step aside until or unless things return to reasonable.

that is my plan, as well. if they don't come back down, i won't buy any. i'll be damned if i'm going to pay thousands of dollars for only a thousand or so dollars of fireworks.. so, i'lll just keep my eye of fireworks prices from the whole sale companies i like and if they don't go down, i'll invest that disposable income on something else.

[mguerra]

What’s the least important thing in the world to spend money on?

[Birdman]

[QUOTE=mguerra;73586]What’s the least important thing in the world to spend money

I wouldn't know...I never wanted it.

[camslam]

I hear what you're saying, the sticker shock was a bit much for me this week as well when I looked over their inventory and pricing. I started ordering from Spirit of 76 in 2016 and took advantage of their special discount structure ($5,000 and higher) which was the most cost effective purchasing I could find in the industry, even factoring in shipping costs. I made subsequent orders even as the special pricing minimum went to $7,500 and now I see the minimum for special pricing is $10,000. Ouch!!!

That being said a few thoughts...

1. Spirit of 76 is a business and from my experience, speaking overall, they have the most varied selection under one roof that I have found. Their pricing especially before all this Covid crap hit was the best I could find if you were either Gold or Special level pricing. From a service perspective I have always been more than satisfied with the work, follow up, execution and timing of orders and shipping, and professionalism I have received. I think it is a top notch organization. Almost every item I purchased over the last few years is more than double the cost of what I previously purchased it at, so literally I am getting less bang for my buck, to the tune of half the pyro I was able to purchase and shoot, for the same cost. I won't be buying any pyro for awhile as I have some personal inventory to use, but it will be fascinating to see how these prices affect the average backyard shooter moving forward.

2. Firework prices have gone through the roof for factors we are all aware of. Do I hope things settle back down? Sure. Is it likely? No. Once prices increase, especially in the amounts we are seeing, it is rare for them to ever drop back down to previous levels. The only reason they will is if fireworks quit selling, and it would have to be significant drops in sales upwards of 75% to 80% declines where distributors were literally sitting on inventory and unable to move it. Unless orders to China basically stop, prices aren't going to recede at all. I stopped by a few retail tents this season and was beyond shocked that the usual 2 for 1 was not in play at most that usually had it and the prices for retail were enough to choke on. ANY of the large 9 to 12+ shot 500g cakes that I bought wholesale for anywhere from $10 to $25 were minimum $80 and up to $170 for some. Z type finale cakes were $200+ for ONE CAKE!!! I was floored...

3. I have ordered from Fireworks Forever, WF Boom, Lew's, Pyroland and prices are up at all of them as well as inventory issues and hiccups across the board. It will be interesting to see if the "golden era" of pyro is over, or if some level of reality creeps back in and we get back to normal with being able to watch our money burn. Bottom line is people spend their money on what they find value in, it can be boats, trips, aquariums, cars, memorabilia, whatever, and of course my favorite, fireworks. With prices where they are at, there will be some that pay, but I think it is going to impact most people negatively where there is less pyro shot overall. I noticed in my area this year there were still plenty of people shooting, but it wasn't even close to the levels I saw last year in both number I could see and hear across the city as well as the duration of people lighting them. Going to be interesting to see how this all plays out.

[Ctpyro180]

Many factors are playing into the price increase...but the biggest is the freight costs...Last year at this time I was paying $10,500.00 for freight on a 40'High Cube container ( From Behai to the East Coast) .. I'm now paying over $28,500.00 for freight on the same container size, then add in demurrage charges at $275.00 per day if the container is not picked up in time by the backed up trucking companies..

to add insult to injury...The exchange rate also drove up a most recent container 7% more...

The cost of freight has now surpassed the cost of some product...Fireworks freight costs are based on the size , not weight, of the carton....So..The bigger the item is, the more you are going to pay.

The shipping companies are the biggest problem and there is no end in sight...

[mguerra]

I’m in a group buy with Spirit at the special pricing level every year. We order in December or January, but this coming order, I’m out… Unless by some miracle prices come down.

[displayfireworks1]

The entire Consumer Fireworks industry has a good and bad problem at the same time. Too much demand and not enough product. My 500 Gram cake with World Class "Academic Pyro" was on ALL the order sheets. If more than a small number of cases made it to USA I would be surprised. Until I see the numbers I suspect none made it before July 4th. There are retail locations out there right now with money to spend and can't get products from Wholesalers. I am purposely doing a slow intro on my new Consumer Fireworks because of limited supply. All of my previous new Displayfireworks1 Consumer Fireworks are sold out. When I was last at my distributor Wholesale Fireworks in Ohio, we were surprised that somehow 2 Willow Beach cakes showed up. LOL
COVID did more for the Consumer Fireworks business than one can imagine. I remember talking with retail location owners back in 2018, they were telling me how bad fireworks sales were predicted to be. Why, because in 2018 July 4th fell on a Wednesday. Historically when July 4th falls on a Wednesday, it is a bad day of the week for fireworks sales. 2020 was a Saturday, 2021 was a Sunday and 2022 will be a Monday. These are all "Good" days.
The big problem currently are the shipping industry and outrageous shipping cost. They blame it on everything from paying for upgrades to the Panama Canal , to demand for the small percentage of hazardous cargo the liner can carry topside, less and larger boats etc. The excuse list goes on and on.

[Fox One]

The entire Consumer Fireworks industry has a good and bad problem at the same time. Too much demand and not enough product. My 500 Gram cake with World Class "Academic Pyro" was on ALL the order sheets. If more than a small number of cases made it to USA I would be surprised. Until I see the numbers I suspect none made it before July 4th. There are retail locations out there right now with money to spend and can't get products from Wholesalers. I am purposely doing a slow intro on my new Consumer Fireworks because of limited supply. All of my previous new Displayfireworks1 Consumer Fireworks are sold out. When I was last at my distributor Wholesale Fireworks in Ohio, we were surprised that somehow 2 Willow Beach cakes showed up. LOL
COVID did more for the Consumer Fireworks business than one can imagine. I remember talking with retail location owners back in 2018, they were telling me how bad fireworks sales were predicted to be. Why, because in 2018 July 4th fell on a Wednesday. Historically when July 4th falls on a Wednesday, it is a bad day of the week for fireworks sales. 2020 was a Saturday, 2021 was a Sunday and 2022 will be a Monday. These are all "Good" days.
The big problem currently are the shipping industry and outrageous shipping cost. They blame it on everything from paying for upgrades to the Panama Canal , to demand for the small percentage of hazardous cargo the liner can carry topside, less and larger boats etc. The excuse list goes on and on.

If the excessive prices start hurting fireworks sales, maybe that Mr. Fireworks guy in China who controls so much of the industry will step up and buy or start his own commercial shipping business. The guy already controls the ports where the product leaves China. And he controls the port here on the west coast where the product comes ashore. He might as well control the shipments while they are on the water. And I bet he will if the shipping industry starts to give him indigestion.

[esgrillo]

I’m in a group buy with Spirit at the special pricing level every year. We order in December or January, but this coming order, I’m out… Unless by some miracle prices come down.

I have already decided I am skipping 2022. The original reasons were not related to the pricing/availability issue but that overlay is validating my original decision.

[Birdman]

I have already decided I am skipping 2022. The original reasons were not related to the pricing/availability issue but that overlay is validating my original decision.

I will miss not seeing a show from you next year!

I've already decided that I'm going to be cutting back this year and only shooting on the 4th. I was expecting to have an even larger budget this year for product but I'm going to be a lot more frugal with my purchases then I was expecting to be. At this point the value just isn't there to justify spending more and ending up gaining nothing. Value is going to be more important than quality this year. Still time for things to change but I don't see it happening this year.

[pyroboom]

The price I set is way, I mean way less than $246.00. Their prices seem OK to me.

[Arles]

Comparing an American Wholesale Fireworks 1.4Pro price list from May to end of July, there are certainly some price increases, but not as bad as I feared. They have a pretty good selection available.

[Kooooou]

I have already decided I am skipping 2022. The original reasons were not related to the pricing/availability issue but that overlay is validating my original decision.
I'm pretty close to skipping 2022 and possibly beyond too if the year-after-year increases don't take a pause. In no way would it be a protest against my long time suppliers but it's more of a sensible decision IMO until China gets its crap together, and if it doesn't then new hobbies here I come. I've done the same with my other (bigger) hobby which is firearms and ammo. Haven't bought anything new since the pandemic inflation started even as inventories have started to normalize for many of my suppliers, but I know they're doing VERY well and am honestly happy for them.

[Birdman]

Comparing an American Wholesale Fireworks 1.4Pro price list from May to end of July, there are certainly some price increases, but not as bad as I feared. They have a pretty good selection available.

I'm patiently awaiting the next price list. A lot will depend on the availability of AoP and not just the prices. The local shop I also purchase from is having decent monthly sales again. I already purchased a couple cakes last month and now I see they have a good sale on canister shells and another cake I think will fit in my show.

[Salutecake]

So I have a bunch of leftovers from the past 2 years to cover my 1.4 needs for next year. the left overs come from incorporating more and more 1.3 stuff so less 1.4 stuff is needed. Just hoping the 1.3 stuff doesn't sky rocket for next year.

[tmwjr]

Well their prices are now as inflated as the approximate heights in all their videos.

[Fox One]

You know what seems the most weird about the massive price increases? It doesn't seem to be showing up as much with the 200 gram cakes. While they may be a little more expensive than they were a year ago, it is a very small change, if any. Meanwhile it seems many of the 500 gram cakes and NOABs have doubled in price. Why are the 200 gram cakes apparently immune to whatever is going on that's driving prices through the roof?

[cduesman]

You know what seems the most weird about the massive price increases? It doesn't seem to be showing up as much with the 200 gram cakes. While they may be a little more expensive than they were a year ago, it is a very small change, if any. Meanwhile it seems many of the 500 gram cakes and NOABs have doubled in price. Why are the 200 gram cakes apparently immune to whatever is going on that's driving prices through the roof?

The majority of the price increase is due to shipping. Shipping is based on the size of the case. They measure them CBM (Cubic Meter).

A shipping container can hold about 68 CBM (depending on it's size).

A 200g case might take up .03-.04 CBM. That might be 8,12,24 or even 48 small items.
a 500g case might take up .07 CBM and be just 4 items.
a NOAB case might take up .11 CBM for just 2 items.

So if your price per CBM almost doubled. It's easier to absorb the increase on 200g cakes since it's less shipping since it's a smaller CBM and it's divided by a larger number of items.

A 4/1 and 2/1 case only have 2 or 4 items to absorb a much larger increase (due to larger CBM).

Chris

[Birdman]

You know what seems the most weird about the massive price increases? It doesn't seem to be showing up as much with the 200 gram cakes. While they may be a little more expensive than they were a year ago, it is a very small change, if any. Meanwhile it seems many of the 500 gram cakes and NOABs have doubled in price. Why are the 200 gram cakes apparently immune to whatever is going on that's driving prices through the roof?

cduesman answered the question with what my assumption on that has been. I wouldn't say 200g cakes have been immune though. This is why I'm looking at using a lot more 200g cakes next year.

Hopefully the industry will adapt and start producing more compact fireworks and stop trying to fool consumers into thinking bigger actually means bigger. Could this spell the end of the ever growing canister shell or NOAB tube size? There's so much wasted space on some products that appears to be there solely to make them look bigger and is not likely required by safety regulations. I suspect they could produce 4/1 9 shot cake that performs just the same as a 2/1 NOAB.

[jamisonlm3]

Hopefully the industry will adapt and start producing more compact fireworks and stop trying to fool consumers into thinking bigger actually means bigger. Could this spell the end of the ever growing canister shell or NOAB tube size? There's so much wasted space on some products that appears to be there solely to make them look bigger and is not likely required by safety regulations. I suspect they could produce 4/1 9 shot cake that performs just the same as a 2/1 NOAB.Thank you. I have the exact same thoughts. So many products are made to look like something they aren't to fool consumers. There's no reason a 9 shot 4/1 cake can't replace the expensive 2/1 noab. The regulation change in china not too long ago seems to have limited noab size to 2". Magnus has a video out detailing the changes and how the new ones will perform the same and be smaller and lighter as a side effect. Likewise, single break shells longer than 4" are pointless. Shells are probably the most expesnive thing to ship as it is. Making them longer and heavier has just increased their price. IMHO, shells have gone up the most.

[Rocketshooter]

Bringing in loose shells and repackaging them here in the us seems to make a lot more sense now.

[displayfireworks1]

I keep saying don't waste worry on the Consumer Fireworks industry and importing fireworks. You are not going to think of something or come up with a solution that has never occurred to the players in the industry. There are so many factors in play right now. Shipping cost per weight or size of container, the packaging regulations , the size and distance between mortar tubes etc. Relax and let it play out.

[Birdman]

I keep saying don't waste worry on the Consumer Fireworks industry and importing fireworks. You are not going to think of something or come up with a solution that has never occurred to the players in the industry. There are so many factors in play right now. Shipping cost per weight or size of container, the packaging regulations , the size and distance between mortar tubes etc. Relax and let it play out.

But we gotta have something to talk about :D

[Arclight]

There are definitely other factors that go into packaging and shipping pyro materials. For instance, I can buy electric detonators for my blasting business as either 1.4B or 1.1B. If they have 16' wires, then they are 1.4B and Fedex can ship them right to my business. If they are 10' leads, then they are 1.1B and the have to be delivered on a placarded HAZMAT truck.

[displayfireworks1]

But we gotta have something to talk about :D

You right. Read this and it will give you some understanding about packaging , length and distance or mortars fuse. Then talk about the standards. This is for AFSL products , however most of the industry follows this to a major degree.
.
https://www.afsl.org/sites/default/files/AFSL%20Standards%2C%202019-07.pdf

[Mattp]

Spoke to a company I use yesterday… to inquire about some prices.. he told me it’s almost changing daily... and for now it’s still going up.. said he just paid 40k for shipping.. the last one was 32k .. prior to pandemic they were paying 9k

[Wholesale Fireworks]

Spoke to a company I use yesterday… to inquire about some prices.. he told me it’s almost changing daily... and for now it’s still going up.. said he just paid 40k for shipping.. the last one was 32k .. prior to pandemic they were paying 9k

Whoever told you that is 100% accurate. The freight cost just keeps going up. It now cost more to ship than the actual cost of the product.

[Mattp]

Whoever told you that is 100% accurate. The freight cost just keeps going up. It now cost more to ship than the actual cost of the product.

Hahaha… yup.. that’s exactly what he said too!!

[Fox One]

Sounds like it is going to get worse before it starts to get better (if it ever gets any better). Ah well, it is what it is. It appears I am going to get much better acquainted with 200 gram cakes over the next year or two.

[displayfireworks1]

I hope some of the pyrotalk forums members read some of the American Fireworks Standard Laboratory (AFSL) regulations I posted . It gives you an understanding of build and packaging of Consumer Fireworks. I suspect if shipping continues to be a cost problem, we will see some sort of work around to the these "Standards". Will the shipping boats charge per container irrespective of weight or will they charge by weight instead of container size? They trick us, we trick them etc. LOL
I suspect this will be a topic for conversation at the National Fireworks Association Convention in September 2021 Erie Pennsylvania.

[morrison2951]

Sounds like it is going to get worse before it starts to get better (if it ever gets any better). Ah well, it is what it is. It appears I am going to get much better acquainted with 200 gram cakes over the next year or two.

Yep. Shoot enough 200g cakes at the same time and it still gets it done.

[Birdman]

I hope some of the pyrotalk forums members read some of the American Fireworks Standard Laboratory (AFSL) regulations I posted . It gives you an understanding of build and packaging of Consumer Fireworks. I suspect if shipping continues to be a cost problem, we will see some sort of work around to the these "Standards". Will the shipping boats charge per container irrespective of weight or will they charge by weight instead of container size? They trick us, we trick them etc. LOL
I suspect this will be a topic for conversation at the National Fireworks Association Convention in September 2021 Erie Pennsylvania.

I found that doc a couple of years ago somewhere and never saved it. I've been wanting to dig it up ever since the issues with shipping AoP out of China popped up. Now there's even more reasons to give it another look.

[esgrillo]

Yep. Shoot enough 200g cakes at the same time and it still gets it done.

yup.... one of my favorite effects is my yearly start to the finale which is 90 bump bears fast fused at 3 locations

[Fox One]

Bump Bear is one of the most awesome little good bang for the buck cakes ever produced!

[Rick_In_Tampa]

I know it's never going to happen, but it would be nice if American fireworks distributors banded together and declared a 2-3 month moratorium on placing orders from China. Let the inventory back up in China and see if the prices don't start to fall.

Or, (and I think Dave mentioned this once before) maybe we incentivize India or Vietnam, or some other country (Mexico?) to start producing fireworks for American markets.

When China is the only game in town, they hold all the cards.

[Salutecake]

Agreed Rick_In_Tampa! I'm not sure why some of these other countries aren't in the game. I'm also hoping the high prices now are going to slow down buying and increase inventory. I hear Mexico is making 1.3 stuff, but I heard from several people it's junk and to stay away. I don't know how true that is because I have not bought or used any 1.3 from Mexico, but perhaps that time is coming in the near future.

[Arclight]

They make e-match and safety fuse and probably detonators in Mexico. Latin American countries still do a lot of mining the old-fashioned way.

[Fox One]

What is driving the massive shipping cost increases? COVID? Natural disasters? Greed? This is getting nuts. I noticed that AWF has raised prices again on many of their products by anywhere from 5 to 10% over the last week. I don't blame the fireworks wholesalers. They are having to raise prices to be able to turn a profit and remain in business and have inventory. But the cost of shipping this stuff from China to U.S. shores is getting beyond ridiculous. I am seeing some NOAB's now priced north of $100 each! Cakes that should cost $20 are selling for $40. Most 24 count boxes of 60 gram canister shells are now anywhere from $75 to $100. Things are now to the point that if you want to put on a $2000 fireworks show, you're going to have to spend $4000 to do it. I doubt many of us have that much disposable income. I know I certainly don't. Next July 4th when we step outside as darkness falls, instead of hearing booms in every direction like normal, I suspect we'll mainly just be hearing insects. Nobody can afford this crap. Wholesale prices are now equal to retail. I'd hate to even look at what the retail stuff is going for. A $20 500 gram cake is probably selling for $100.

[Birdman]

Based on what I've read there are MANY factors that were in large part brought on by COVID shutdowns. In short though it can be boiled down to more demand than shipping capacity. Demand for goods out of China is being largely fueled by a few major factors:

- Businesses needing to restock after exhausting inventories during COVID shutdowns
- People spending COVID stimulus money on goods
- People spending money on goods that would otherwise be spent on things like travel and entertainment
- Many Chinese factories didn?t take a normal break during the Lunar New Year holiday, preventing transport networks from taking up some slack

Not only do you have high demand but you have the capacity issues that are affecting the supply of shipping containers and ships that can carry cargo. The major issue there is congestion at the ports. There are other factors, besides the high demand, driving the congestion:

- Limited rail capacity and trucking labor shortages to get goods out of ports and to their destination
- Natural disasters and other events preventing goods from leaving or arriving at ports (e.g. wildfires, floods, storms, COVID lockdowns, ships blocking canals, etc)
- Empty containers piling up at ports and/or not getting returned full of goods

To put this in perspective, in normal times it would take about 2 weeks for goods to arrive in the US from China. In these unusual times ships can wait more than two weeks to be unloaded at a port after their two week journey. This is essentially reducing shipping capacity by 50%. The good news is that analysts are saying we may start to see some of the capacity issues begin to ease after February 2022. That is assuming no additional widespread COVID related shutdowns and a normal break in Chinese manufacturing during the Lunar New Year holiday.

[Fox One]

Good explanation, Birdman. That is a ton of factors working together to create this nightmare. Hopefully things get somewhat back to normal over the course of the next year or so, though I doubt we ever see things get back to the way they were in 2019. Hopefully with prices sky rocketing, the demand is going to drop significantly, which will in turn allow stock to start building. It seems reasonable that once the stock reaches a certain point, the prices should start coming back down. I just can't see too many people willing to spend $110 on a NOAB, no matter how good it might be.

I've been witnessing pretty much the same thing happening in another of my hobby areas---firearms, or to be more specific, ammunition. During 2020, there were 3 major factors that came together to create the biggest ammo shortage I've ever seen in this country. People started "panic buying" ammunition in early March when it began obvious COVID was going to be a big deal here. Then there was lots of civil unrest over the summer that further exacerbated the problem. And of course there was the November election that only further lead to people buying everything they could get their hands on. At the peak of the craziness, I was seeing 50 round boxes of cheap 9mm FMJ practice rounds going for $50 a box, or more. Those typically sold for $10 before the panic. The prices finally got so crazy that most people stopped buying. Since then, the inventory levels have gone up some and the prices have come down some. Many calibers are still incredibly hard (if not impossible) to find. But the more common use ammunition is becoming more plentiful and the prices have dropped some. Those $50 boxes of 9mm can now be found for $29.95 pretty easily. There's still a long way to go, but at least things are trending in the right direction.

[Birdman]

The big difference between fireworks and bullets is that the cost of bullets appears to have increased solely because they could be sold at a higher cost and not because they were costing more to manufacture and distribute (i.e. more to do with greed). My fear is we won't see prices drop much for fireworks even if demand drops, at least until the current inventory can be replaced with inventory that was cheaper to ship. If demand doesn't drop significantly then there would be little incentive to reduce prices even if shipping costs come down. IMO, it will take something like a major economic downturn to reduce demand significantly. While I believe some of the recent demand is/was temporary (COVID related), I think a lot of the demand is because you have more people who have access to purchase fireworks. For example, here in PA, not only do you now have PA residents purchasing fireworks but you also have a lot of people coming in from neighboring states (e.g. NY NJ DE). The parking lots seem to get fuller and fuller every season as word gets out (I have 3 stores within 1/2 mile of my home). Then you have more residents such as myself that are purchasing wholesale as word gets out. This is all purely guesswork and speculation on my part. We will just have to wait to see how the market dynamics play out over the next year or two.

[Salutecake]

Add this to your list Birdman, people in the US just don't want to work, adding to the shipping and distribution of many products. An example, I know 2 different people, working at 2 different Wally world distribution centers in 2 different states, hundreds of miles apart. In both places they had to go out and rent parking space for trailers that aren't getting unloaded. I know the 1 Wally World is pay 22 an hour to start, they train you if needed and if you show up for work for 2 weeks in a row, you get a 700 dollar bonus every 2 weeks. The other Distribution center ended up employing refugees.

And I didn't mean to pick on Wally World, but I have first hand info there. I also see local adds from other company offering similar deals. If I wasn't retired, I thought about applying.

[Wholesale Fireworks]

Add this to your list Birdman, people in the US just don't want to work, adding to the shipping and distribution of many products. An example, I know 2 different people, working at 2 different Wally world distribution centers in 2 different states, hundreds of miles apart. In both places they had to go out and rent parking space for trailers that aren't getting unloaded. I know the 1 Wally World is pay 22 an hour to start, they train you if needed and if you show up for work for 2 weeks in a row, you get a 700 dollar bonus every 2 weeks. The other Distribution center ended up employing refugees.

And I didn't mean to pick on Wally World, but I have first hand info there. I also see local adds from other company offering similar deals. If I wasn't retired, I thought about applying.

Bring me up to speed...Is Wally World a local business in your area? I have never heard of it. Just curious. We have a similar situation in our area. Distribution centers are offering big bonuses to get workers.

[Greenville Pyro]

Its a euphemism for Walmart

[Arclight]

For what it's worth, Debbie from Combined Specialties Insurance tells me she is as busy as ever with all kinds of retail, display and other fireworks business.

[Birdman]

I did mention "trucking labor shortages". I don't believe there is a shortage of truckers because people don't want to work. I believe it's just people don't want to be truckers. It's a very demanding highly regulated and structured job with long hours away from home.

[Scotty Rockets]

Let me introduce you all to the main reason for higher prices.
Meet Mr. Ding the fireworks king

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2018/business/the-largest-supplier-of-american-fireworks-is-from-china/

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Good read. Very informative. Makes me sick! But very informative.

[Salutecake]

Working Backwards, I agree with Rick on Scotty Rockets article.
Birdman, I've had a CDL since before all the regulations, and I agree with you on the regulation side. Before all the regulations, you went to a testing site drove the rig in a circle and they stamped tour license. first regulations - Medical exam, test included pre-trip inspection, written test, on road driving test. Now, from what understand, you still need all the previous stuff but the pre-trip inspection is more like a mechanics test, the Hazmat includes background checks finger prints and written test, also if you take a test in a vehicle with an auto transmission you can only drive that type, so it limits new truckers on what they can drive, Along with that medical requirements, one example almost half the people in the US have high blood pressure and type 2 diabetes, either one on those requires a medical exam every year, and sometimes requires proof from your GP that your conditions are controlled, then for the most part- the pay sux.
So, in a couple of years, and already out, the self driving truck, is/will be on the road.
Yes to Greenville Pyro for answering Ray's question.

[Birdman]

Let me introduce you all to the main reason for higher prices.
Meet Mr. Ding the fireworks king

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2018/business/the-largest-supplier-of-american-fireworks-is-from-china/

That was written June 27, 2018, before the pandemic and the current shipping situation. I'm sure it's still somewhat relevant but all sectors are effected by the current situation, not just fireworks.

[Birdman]

Working Backwards, I agree with Rick on Scotty Rockets article.
Birdman, I've had a CDL since before all the regulations, and I agree with you on the regulation side. Before all the regulations, you went to a testing site drove the rig in a circle and they stamped tour license. first regulations - Medical exam, test included pre-trip inspection, written test, on road driving test. Now, from what understand, you still need all the previous stuff but the pre-trip inspection is more like a mechanics test, the Hazmat includes background checks finger prints and written test, also if you take a test in a vehicle with an auto transmission you can only drive that type, so it limits new truckers on what they can drive, Along with that medical requirements, one example almost half the people in the US have high blood pressure and type 2 diabetes, either one on those requires a medical exam every year, and sometimes requires proof from your GP that your conditions are controlled, then for the most part- the pay sux.
So, in a couple of years, and already out, the self driving truck, is/will be on the road.
Yes to Greenville Pyro for answering Ray's question.

My wife's employer is looking for a driver. Starting pay is not great but it is a union job so pay will come with time and the benefits are excellent and includes a pension plan. Besides the starting pay, the biggest barrier is finding people that are willing to submit to drug screenings (recreational marijuana is legal in that state). I know another person that retired from trucking many years ago when they installed GPS tracking equipment on all of the trucks. He said it was too big brother-ish and the appeal of trucking for him was the freedom of being on the road instead of working in an office or plant where the bosses are always watching. With GPS he lost all sense of that freedom. He was making good money, six figures, but that was about 20 years ago. He actually passed away about a year after retirement.
I totally agree the self driving truck is likely going to be the answer. We are not too far away from seeing autonomous trucks and cars on the road. I follow that technology fairly closely and I find that people don't realize how close we are. In a matter of a few decades most everyone will be using autonomous vehicles. I have many people tell me they will never ride in an autonomous vehicle but even new cars today are overriding human driver errors and these optional safety options will not be optional as they are proven effective. There will be many more of them added to cars as time goes on. From there it's just a matter of time before people decide it's just easier to have the vehicle drive for you instead of fighting your car for control. The plan is in place and there is big money behind it. It's just a matter of time at this point.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

From there it's just a matter of time before people decide it's just easier to have the vehicle drive for you instead of fighting your car for control.

My buddy and I rented a car when we were in Fargo last month for PGI. It was a Nissan SUV of some flavor. Every time you changed lanes or got near a white line on the road the damn thing would start beeping and chiming all over the place. It was maddening. I had a loaner Cadillac CT6 with every bell and whistle they offer. If the car thought I got too close to someone the HUD would blink a big red warning. The seat would vibrate like I was sitting on a blender, and the steering wheel shook. It was insane! The service dept guy asked me how I liked it. I told him I wouldn't own one if it was free!

[Scotty Rockets]

That was written June 27, 2018, before the pandemic and the current shipping situation. I'm sure it's still somewhat relevant but all sectors are effected by the current situation, not just fireworks.

How about an article from forbes dated 2020, Same information and story as 2018
https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2020/07/01/china-accounts-for-94-of-us-fireworks-imports-infographic/?sh=35d20a728f98

[morrison2951]

Good explanation, Birdman.... I just can't see too many people willing to spend $110 on a NOAB, no matter how good it might be.

Whacky Tobacky is $145 at my retailer. :(

[Kman]

A Chinese communist is using capitalist principles and unfortunately has created a monopoly in the fireworks shipping industry. It will take the law of supply and demand to kick in to drive down prices.

[Rocketshooter]

After checking all of my wholesale sources, everyone is at least 35 to 50% on their increases. I haven't looked at retail lately but i'm sure its up accordingly.
I look for a down year on fireworks as inflation is taking a big bite out of everyone's paycheck and no more Covid money flowing in. My show for one, will be down sized this year.
Good 500g 4/1 cases went from 75-80 to 120-130, 4/24 shells are way north of $200 , even 200g 12/1 cases are getting close to $100.

[leftiluci]

Quit all your bitchin,, learn how to make your own. There's plenty of resources out there. . Boo hoo that the days of taking advantage of slave labor is upsetting your non essential hobby. If you're that concerned about all this, then pull your heads out of your asses and learn what made in America means. It can mean you. Not a corporation. Oh yeah, and someone from Tampa Florida forgot a. silent p before their 1st name. ❤️Luci

[jknepp1954]

After checking all of my wholesale sources, everyone is at least 35 to 50% on their increases. I haven't looked at retail lately but i'm sure its up accordingly.
I look for a down year on fireworks as inflation is taking a big bite out of everyone's paycheck and no more Covid money flowing in. My show for one, will be down sized this year.
Good 500g 4/1 cases went from 75-80 to 120-130, 4/24 shells are way north of $200 , even 200g 12/1 cases are getting close to $100.
Unfortuneately only going to get worse instead of better.....buy now while you can as things will be higher first of yr - if not before....Just saying....

[Birdman]

Unfortuneately only going to get worse instead of better.....buy now while you can as things will be higher first of yr - if not before....Just saying....

I was on a SO76 webinar and they had mentioned that the manufactures have experienced an increase cost for raw materials. Paper apparently is the big one. So not only is there all of the other issues, there's now this one adding to the cost. They did say that they and the manufactures will absorb some of the increased cost but that some of the increase will need to be passed on to customers.

[camslam]

Genuinely curious on peoples opinions on this:

1. With prices going "sky high" (pun intended), do most of you feel things are getting to the point where a significant number of consumers are getting priced out of the market? Even if purchases are still being made, with the rising costs of everything everywhere, I can't imagine most average holiday celebrating consumers are going to have loads of discretionary income to pay to watch their money literally burn. So at a minimum I see demand lessening to a certain degree because prices are so high. Purchases may be made, but I assume they will be scaled back, the question is to what degree.

2. If that is the case, who is going to get stuck footing the bill? Here me out, let's say all of our favorite wholesalers have been buying at the elevated prices, basically hoping and depending on the final consumer to foot the bill and cover their costs for supplying the fireworks, if consumer demand falls off, possibly significantly, then won't our wholesale companies be left footing the bill as they have to lower prices to get rid of their inventory that was purchased at higher price levels?

3. I have made significant purchases going back to 2016 personally for enjoyment as a hobby, luckily I have decent supply to allow for me to continue enjoying fireworks for awhile, but when I look at Spirit of 76, Fireworks Forever, WFBoom, etc..., all of them have had very significant price increases (through no fault of their own) that have almost eliminated my plans to purchase pyro. I have a few items I want and need to pick up to highlight or add accents to parts of my personal shows, but I don't plan to make any large purchase orders until prices level and come back down to something reasonable. Yes, I am aware that might not happen. What surprises me is I have received recent emails from Fireworks Forever showing what is actually in stock with the representation that stuff is flying out the door as soon as it comes in, it leaves me wondering who is buying it and will consumers ultimately pay those prices for pyro? Will it be the small retailer (tents/corners/holiday sales) that buys and is left holding the bag with inventory they can't sell at the prices they need to cover costs and make a modest profit?

We live in interesting times for sure....

[Birdman]

Genuinely curious on peoples opinions on this:

1. With prices going "sky high" (pun intended), do most of you feel things are getting to the point where a significant number of consumers are getting priced out of the market? Even if purchases are still being made, with the rising costs of everything everywhere, I can't imagine most average holiday celebrating consumers are going to have loads of discretionary income to pay to watch their money literally burn. So at a minimum I see demand lessening to a certain degree because prices are so high. Purchases may be made, but I assume they will be scaled back, the question is to what degree.

2. If that is the case, who is going to get stuck footing the bill? Here me out, let's say all of our favorite wholesalers have been buying at the elevated prices, basically hoping and depending on the final consumer to foot the bill and cover their costs for supplying the fireworks, if consumer demand falls off, possibly significantly, then won't our wholesale companies be left footing the bill as they have to lower prices to get rid of their inventory that was purchased at higher price levels?

3. I have made significant purchases going back to 2016 personally for enjoyment as a hobby, luckily I have decent supply to allow for me to continue enjoying fireworks for awhile, but when I look at Spirit of 76, Fireworks Forever, WFBoom, etc..., all of them have had very significant price increases (through no fault of their own) that have almost eliminated my plans to purchase pyro. I have a few items I want and need to pick up to highlight or add accents to parts of my personal shows, but I don't plan to make any large purchase orders until prices level and come back down to something reasonable. Yes, I am aware that might not happen. What surprises me is I have received recent emails from Fireworks Forever showing what is actually in stock with the representation that stuff is flying out the door as soon as it comes in, it leaves me wondering who is buying it and will consumers ultimately pay those prices for pyro? Will it be the small retailer (tents/corners/holiday sales) that buys and is left holding the bag with inventory they can't sell at the prices they need to cover costs and make a modest profit?

We live in interesting times for sure....

Just guessing here but as for 1....

I don't believe very many fireworks consumer will be priced out of the market completely. Some will buy less and some will spend more. I don't believe we will see a situation where supply is higher than demand.

As for 2....

If demand is indeed higher than supply there will be no bag holding.

and 3....

I assume the vast majority of wholesale purchases are made for for-profit reasons. I suspect consumers such as yourself or others around here will not cut back enough to effect supply. If there are casualties on the retail side that only reduces competition which is also not helpful in reducing prices in the long term. I hope I'm wrong, but even if shipping costs come down I don't see that causing prices to drop much if demand keeps on pace. I believe the best we can hope for is that prices stabilize. Only time will tell.

I can't even tell you for sure how the current situation is even going to effect my purchases going forward. My biggest frustration is supply and not prices. I'm use to working within a budget but it's pointless to script a show when you can't rely on the product being available. I'm just waiting for something to motivate me at this point.

[Greenville Pyro]

Just guessing here but as for 1....

I don't believe very many fireworks consumer will be priced out of the market completely. Some will buy less and some will spend more. I don't believe we will see a situation where supply is higher than demand.

As for 2....

If demand is indeed higher than supply there will be no bag holding.

and 3....

I assume the vast majority of wholesale purchases are made for for-profit reasons. I suspect consumers such as yourself or others around here will not cut back enough to effect supply. If there are casualties on the retail side that only reduces competition which is also not helpful in reducing prices in the long term. I hope I'm wrong, but even if shipping costs come down I don't see that causing prices to drop much if demand keeps on pace. I believe the best we can hope for is that prices stabilize. Only time will tell.

I can't even tell you for sure how the current situation is even going to effect my purchases going forward. My biggest frustration is supply and not prices. I'm use to working within a budget but it's pointless to script a show when you can't rely on the product being available. I'm just waiting for something to motivate me at this point.


The last part is what is killing me. Its the supply. I am working with "what I can get" but that changes frequently. Right now I want to put in an order, but I'm holding out hoping something I want will maybe make it. But, by the time it comes in, I'm worried what is there now will sell out. I refuse to pay shipping twice...

[BMoore]

The last part is what is killing me. Its the supply. I am working with "what I can get" but that changes frequently. Right now I want to put in an order, but I'm holding out hoping something I want will maybe make it. But, by the time it comes in, I'm worried what is there now will sell out. I refuse to pay shipping twice...

Same here. I can change my budget and/or my show, but the supply issue is what hurts. Do I buy what I can get now or hold out for what I want and risk losing what I can get. Right now I'm monitoring inventory like a hawk and ordering anything I can use as soon as it comes available but still holding out for some key items. No matter what I do it's a gamble and no matter how it shakes out I'll be left throwing my show together last minute because I don't know what I'll end up having available. The other issue is, all of us in the buy early and buy often camp are driving the supply & demand imbalance and actually making the problem worse to some degree.

All of this will eventually stabilize but I feel like it's going to get worse before it gets better. This is affecting everything, not just fireworks. Have you seen the price of steak lately? Sheesh! At least my favorite local restaurant has chicken wings again so that's a positive.

[Okimarine]

Same here. I can change my budget and/or my show, but the supply issue is what hurts. Do I buy what I can get now or hold out for what I want and risk losing what I can get. Right now I'm monitoring inventory like a hawk and ordering anything I can use as soon as it comes available but still holding out for some key items. No matter what I do it's a gamble and no matter how it shakes out I'll be left throwing my show together last minute because I don't know what I'll end up having available. The other issue is, all of us in the buy early and buy often camp are driving the supply & demand imbalance and actually making the problem worse to some degree.

All of this will eventually stabilize but I feel like it's going to get worse before it gets better. This is affecting everything, not just fireworks. Have you seen the price of steak lately? Sheesh! At least my favorite local restaurant has chicken wings again so that's a positive.

Same here. I've been adding to an order everytime new stock comes in for a couple months now. Will probably pick up in December. Minus some 1.4pro items I easily have enough for a couple good shows next year but I haven't started doing pyromusicals yet so those items mean less to me than others. As high as prices are now, I'm afraid waiting may either cost more or have less of a selection so im not taking chances.

[Birdman]

Same here. I can change my budget and/or my show, but the supply issue is what hurts. Do I buy what I can get now or hold out for what I want and risk losing what I can get. Right now I'm monitoring inventory like a hawk and ordering anything I can use as soon as it comes available but still holding out for some key items. No matter what I do it's a gamble and no matter how it shakes out I'll be left throwing my show together last minute because I don't know what I'll end up having available. The other issue is, all of us in the buy early and buy often camp are driving the supply & demand imbalance and actually making the problem worse to some degree.

All of this will eventually stabilize but I feel like it's going to get worse before it gets better. This is affecting everything, not just fireworks. Have you seen the price of steak lately? Sheesh! At least my favorite local restaurant has chicken wings again so that's a positive.

This pretty much sums up my frustrations. It's the gamble that is most frustrating. That's why I'm just going to hold off. If I can't get 1.4pro I probably won't order wholesale. I'll just hope to get some product locally on sale and see what I can do with what I decide to get. I already had a soundtrack down with about 50% of it scripted, keeping the increased costs in mind. I've scrapped trying to do that show without 1.4pro and will save it for when things hopefully normalize a bit more. I'm fully expecting to have a quaint backyard type show. If I can do better than that, great. I'm just not willing to put in the time to script a new show without having product in hand and I'm not going to push the budget unless I see something inspiring to me coming together.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Speaking for myself, I'm buying a lot less this year than in previous years. I shot 50 cases last year and I'm only ordering 30 this year. I use SO76 and they seem to have a pretty good selection of stuff to choose from, but they have virtually no "Pro line" items. That is what's going to kill my show next year.

From the few tent owners I know and from what they tell me the markup on pyro is really really good. So even with the massive price increases, the distributors are still going to make money, even if sales are lower. I don't see any way that demand this year is as high as previous years. Not with the big price increases. So I see prices remaining high next year, especially if the current administration can't get the shipping backlog figured out. With a 2 year drought in sales due to high prices and low demand, the prices will have to come down.

[Salutecake]

Agreed Rick_In_Tampa! But I don't believe prices are going to come down any time soon. But I'll go one step further, by the time the current shipping crisis is over, new rules in China mfg and shipping will kick in, along with any other "disaster" will add to the total cost once again. So if it takes 2 to 3 years for "Things" to get back to "Normal" a price increase might happen or perhaps the prices now will remain the same, but not go down.

Depending upon the supply and demand you might find discounts, but discounts off current elevated prices, not prices of 2 years ago. Back in the 70's a coffee crisis occurred, a Big freeze in Brazil created a shortage and a price rise, and while the coffee supply increased in a few years the prices stayed pretty much at the inflated rate.

Let's face it, China has a monopoly on the fireworks industry. Until there is any real competition out there we are going to be at the mercy of China.

So it boils down to a personal wait and see, supply and demand, and the price we are all willing to pay.

[camslam]

I appreciate the responses, definitely going to be interesting. The only thing I would note is this: We are all a bunch of nutjob pyros that love our fireworks and buy them. We are literally in a pyro forum discussing fireworks, we plan, buy, enjoy, and shoot fireworks, some sell them.

Clearly from the number of events, associations, shows, youtube videos, etc., fireworks are EXTREMELY popular and that is a great thing. I think the issue is reality, how many people are passionate enough about, or enjoy fireworks enough, or have the budget enough to pay the prices that we see now?

Going back to 2019 I was buying Whacky Tobacky NOAB's that we are all familiar with for $69.23 per case. That included a discount for the pricing level I was at, but currently if I wanted that same case of Whacky Tobacky I am looking at $174.30 plus shipping. That's roughly a 152% INCREASE over what I paid previous. Pretty much everything else I have purchased in the past is more than double the cost now.

This gets to the point Rick In Tampa made, where he was buying 50 cases before, now he'll be down to 30. I won't say how many cases I have purchased over the last 5 years, but I have 20 Cobra Modules and a whole bunch of equipment I have built, assembled, or acquired to shoot fun "backyard shows". I can tell you where I may have been able to put on a great show for around $3,500 to $4,000 in the past, the economics of it don't make sense to do that moving forward. Either I can do the same show for $8,500 to $9,000 or I can cut the number of items and basically do half the show I have done for years.

I think the real question is where do the bulk of firework sales come from? Passionate nut jobs like us or the average consumer that spends "X" amount on fireworks each year? I don't know the answer and I think it is going to be interesting to see how it all shakes out, but I can tell you I plan to shoot what I have for my shows for as long as I have product to do it, but if prices stay at the elevated levels they are I am not sure I will keep doing it. I also understand I can scale things back, but I would imagine most of us would agree when you have been shooting shows, scripting, enjoying the process, not sure there is much joy to scaling things back, to me it would be unfulfilling and disappointing. Will the average consumer that spent $250 to $500 for an enjoyable holiday still spend that with prices where they are at? By the time you get to the tent and buy retail, $250 to $500 just isn't going to go very far unless you are buying a bunch of novelty items and 200 gram cakes. I guess time will tell...

[Birdman]

I think most of us are in the same boat regardless of budget but those with much smaller budgets can probably absorb the increase much easier. I know with my meager budget of around 2000 to 2500, I wouldn't have to downsize to the extent those with much larger budgets would have to. That's why I say for me, it's not the cost increase but the supply issue. I could do a comparable show to other years but I've always had to get creative and judicious with the product I was purchasing to script a decent show. That is much harder with the supply issues. It could take me days if not weeks finding that one cake that fits into my show. Now I could put all that effort into finding that one cake but it may not be available when I've settled on it. This was even beginning to happen last year as I scrambled to find replacements for product that has always been available in the past. My plan this year was to script a show with AOP being the base to hit the highs and lows (as was the case last year when I first started using AOP) and fill in with multiple 200G cakes (which haven't seen as steep of increases) instead of bigger 9 shot, zipper cakes etc. But with very little AOP out there that plan is out the window, at least for now.

I suspect the average budget is less than 1K. I had a friend that worked at a store and he said most sales where in that range when I asked. The larger purchases were often group buys and many of the very large purchases we're clearly being purchased to be resold where fireworks are illegal or hard to get. I've overheard several conversations myself at fireworks stores where people were discussing reselling them. So even many of the big purchases are being distributed to people with smaller budgets. The cost increase won't hit these consumers as hard. Maybe they downgrade to 200G gram cakes from 500G cakes and 60G shells. And lets not forget the many that are buying much smaller stuff. Before I did shows I would go and get one or two cakes at BOGO or B1G2 on paydays and shot one that weekend and save the other(s) for the 4th. Even though I was overpaying, spread out like that, it didn't hit the wallet as hard.

[Salutecake]

Hey Camslam, It is going to be interesting this year. I'm not sure that the average joe that goes on vacation and picks up some fireworks, is going to note the price increase(?) I'm sure some are going to say a got a lot more last year for my 500 bucks, buy being on vacation he is going to by them anyway, so there are always going to be those types of sales.
For the rest of us, well, it's going to be a shoot'n match. I know I will compare what I got last year to present prices and go from there. There will also be the newb without regard to price, so as the old drop out the new slip in. We can also slow the show down a bit to spread it out, when I was a kid, I could remember going to some fireworks shows that you might fall asleep in the amount of time it would take in-between shells, now it seems for most shows a second can't go by without a multitude of things going off.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

What?s the least important thing in the world to spend money on?

You mean besides women, drugs, and women?

[Rick_In_Tampa]

I?m in a group buy with Spirit at the special pricing level every year. We order in December or January, but this coming order, I?m out? Unless by some miracle prices come down.

I also do a group buy with my pyro buddy. We placed our orders in October this year. Mine is set to ship on Dec 30th. It will be my last order until prices come down. I already waste a ridiculous amount of money on my July 4th show. There's no way I'm paying 50%-100% more for the same show. They can keep it in China as far as I'm concerned.

[Salutecake]

Most likely after the New Year, I will start an order and see what I can get at last years prices and perhaps add about 10 percent. I'll go from there, whether or not or how much I will spend this year.

My question is: What will prices be when things get back to "Normal". I'm betting that Normal prices in 2 to 3 years will still be at least 25% higher than they are now.

[Icooclast]

What?s the least important thing in the world to spend money on?

fireworks don't even touch that list when you think of all the really wasteful things the rich buy.

i submit for your review:

https://www.vogue.com.au/fashion/news/the-most-expensive-fantasy-bras-to-ever-walk-the-victorias-secret-runway/image-gallery/6b060526a624e7bf9f9c4bac2cca6757

https://us.louisvuitton.com/eng-us/women/watches/all-watches-and-accessories/_/N-18m78ex?gclid=Cj0KCQiAkNiMBhCxARIsAIDDKNUsLuBXm1rb 90XNjeuRSrnIxaCqVi2M5Ots0Mn3m1BYtAIjSg5RuS4aAkz0EA Lw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

then there's the obvious lux. cars, yachts, strip clubs, big mansions when it's just you and 3 other people in the house fancy in-ground pools.

now for the common made it is strip clubs, drugs/alcohol, tobacco products, gambling. i could most likely go on, but i'll stop there. as for the coming fourth, i am sitting out again and likely till when prices and selection are way better... if that ever happens.

good luck everyone

[patsy]

Spirit of 76 just posted updated pricing on a lot of items. I am seeing 30%-50% price increases on the few items they are listing now. For example, Pro Line 9 shot Kamuro, now $246 for a case, I paid $166 5 months ago; Pro Line 36 shot RWB Peony, now $128 for a case, I paid $91 5 months ago. Man, if that kind of price increase remains, that is gonna put a hurt on a few shows.

UGH!!

Unfortunately inflation is everywhere and there are even delays concerning imports. These have been really tough times for everyone all across the board. Its just terrible making an already expensive hobby now astrenomical.

[Pnut]

I ordered a pallet of product from a American Wholesale, who have good prices, and I greatly noticed how much buying power we lost on fireworks!

[Ctpyro180]

Freight prices per container averaged $12,000.00 this time last year...

I'm now paying $38,000.00 per container...just for freight (Went up another $10,000.00 since my earlier post back in July)

There is no end in sight for these freight price increases which now supersede the cost of product. Large 500 gram items will take the biggest hit and will almost double in price this coming season...

I also forgot to mention the recent 5% increase of manufacturing the product....second increase in less than 90 days..

[Arclight]

Freight prices per container averaged $12,000.00 this time last year...

I'm now paying $38,000.00 per container...just for freight (Went up another $10,000.00 since my earlier post back in July)

There is no end in sight for these freight price increases which now supersede the cost of product. Large 500 gram items will take the biggest hit and will almost double in price this coming season...

I also forgot to mention the recent 5% increase of manufacturing the product....second increase in less than 90 days..

Given the insane transportation costs, what products (per net weight) represent the best value? Would it be 200g cakes, or articles like bundles of Roman Candles?

[Ctpyro180]

Given the insane transportation costs, what products (per net weight) represent the best value? Would it be 200g cakes, or articles like bundles of Roman Candles?

Its not the weight ...It is the size & class per case (CBM) that is impacting the cost of all goods imported... Bigger the item is the more it will cost to ship..

Fireworks and other haz mat commodities are allocated only certain amount of slips on a container ship, so the freight prices are quite expensive compared to other non hazardous commodities...

[Justintime]

Just got hit with a $38,675 shipping charge, which works out to $577.00 per cubic meter of space which is approx 39"x39"x39" a slight bit larger than a cubic yard. The amount of fireworks you can fit in that space cost $577.00
just for shipping PLUS duty, testing, insurance and the cost of the product. As the higher priced items arrive prices go up so buy as early as you can for the 2022 season.

[Arclight]

This is crazy. I wonder what a cubic meter of 1.4 would cost to air ship? It seems like the gap is closing substantially.

[Icooclast]

i don't think anyone wants EXPLOSIVES on a plane, lol. plus; i think there's a federal law against even taking a pack of firecrackers on a plane, let-a-lone anything bigger.

[Arclight]

i don't think anyone wants EXPLOSIVES on a plane, lol. plus; i think there's a federal law against even taking a pack of firecrackers on a plane, let-a-lone anything bigger.

Cargo-only planes do accept 1.4 shipments. I have had Fedex air ship specialty items for me before.

[esgrillo]

Just got hit with a $38,675 shipping charge, which works out to $577.00 per cubic meter of space which is approx 39"x39"x39" a slight bit larger than a cubic yard. The amount of fireworks you can fit in that space cost $577.00
just for shipping PLUS duty, testing, insurance and the cost of the product. As the higher priced items arrive prices go up so buy as early as you can for the 2022 season.

It is just insane, I just landed a non-hazardous 40ft for $21500. Used to be $8500 in early 2020

[Engineer Cat]

I called one of my "local" places after seeing on their website they are having a 50% off sale and claim to be fully stocked. (North Eastern PA) It's not my regular place so this will be my first visit. They do wholesale but don't ship, but I'm not spending enough for that anyway. I asked him if they got a shipment and are currently overstocked hence the 50% off and he said no. He said they had plenty of product in their warehouse on reserve and are fully stocked. "We played it smart".

As for the discount they are selling items such as Growler shells, Willow Kings shells pack normally $99 on sale $50. Arms Depot 16 shells for $35, 500g cakes from Raccoon, Supreme, Brothers and Power Blast for between $20 and $30 after the discount. Raccoon NOABs for $50. Also if you spend $750 you get $300 in free items. (apparently)

Honestly one of my reasons for checking them out is the cakes seems a bit more creative then the brands I been shooting for years so I want those effects that I don't normally get since AOP items don't seem worth the cost and effort this year. I'm planning on taking a ride tomorrow and seeing what is what. I'll update this after I visit.

[Engineer Cat]

Just a follow up. Was to good to be true. They said the prices online are with the discount even thought when I called they said they were not. Also the prices were more expensive than they had posted online. They are claiming their $50 cakes are worth $100. I haven't had any of these cakes before so I don't know what the actual price is but I'm pretty sure they are not worth $100 a cake. I did buy stuff thought because I was tired of getting the same old stuff from my regular place.

They did have plenty of product but of course no fuse.

I did get Blond Joke, The Star Chamber and Saturday Night Special for free.
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