To remove cake tops or not to remove cake tops...that is the question

[ssmith512]

Yo fellow pyro's. Grasshopper hear wanting some advice from the Master's.

I will be doing my first "big" show this 4th with my fancy new Cobra system. I have a lot of 500g cakes that will be huddle together in groups (see layout drawing).

My question is on removing the top of the cakes (to help with minimizing cleanup). Or is it not worth the chance of cross firing just to save on an extra 30 minutes of cleanup after the show? I was also thinking of maybe cutting only three sides of the top of the cakes so that maybe when the cake fires it folds over the top instead of blowing it into 100's of pieces.

Note: I am not opposed to cleanup after the show, I am just lazy by nature and dont want to physically exert myself anymore than I have to!! LOL!!

Your thoughts/advice/suggestions please.

Thanks in advance!!

5715

[BMoore]

I remove the tops of my 1.4 cakes before bagging them for rain protection. It saves on cleanup plus eliminates another layer to have to shoot through. I've seen some people cut an "X" on the tops and honestly I can't tell if that helps or not. Seems like the velocity still shreds the paper. As far as cross firing it doesn't seem to be a major issue, but a thin layer of paper and cellophane isn't going to offer much protection anyway. If you have items which you absolutely must protect from cross fire, you need to cover them with foil.

[Rocketshooter]

One advantage to leaving the tops on is that you can tell if some of the tubes didn't fire. That keeps the burn pile from getting exciting.

[jamisonlm3]

You can also tell if the cake didn't fire because there's no residue on the inside of the tubes. Black powder is very dirty and will leave a light coating of a dark residue inside the tubes. Leaving the tops on will make it much more apparent at night to tell if a cake didn't shoot. Personally, I leave the tops on. I don't see a huge benifit to taking them off.

[Salutecake]

I'm lazy like you, but I leave the tops on. You're going to have a mess to clean up no matter what you do. Here is my ritual. Most people leave shortly after the fireworks end but a handful always stay behind to help clean up. Anything that's burnable gets piled up and set on fire. Shortly after that, the second show begins with what did shoot off during the show now shoots off in the fire (Yep Rocketshooter exciting), I think that's why some people stay, lol. Now it's time to sit back have my ceremonial beer and cigar. In the morning my neighbor hops on his lawn mower circles the area shooting the junk into piles, pick up the few piles and throw in fire, DUN, lol. Also the grass is cut and any pieces left behind are now chopped up fine and will disintegrate in a few weeks.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

I always remove the tops of the cakes before I shoot. With the amount of cakes I shoot I find it really makes a difference with the cleanup. As others have said, it's easy to spot the cakes that didn't fire by simply looking down at them with a light. The cakes that didn't fire will be clean inside and they will still have the cardboard disk sealing off the tubes. Those cakes I take home with me immediately after the show. The rest of the carcasses sit out overnight and we pick them up in the morning and take them to the dump.

[Birdman]

I've tried it all and for less mess you can't beat removing the tops completely. I've had mixed results with cutting the tops on 3 sides, X etc. Found in some cases that seemed to create more mess. Lately I've been just leaving the tops on for added protection because I found I'm not the one doing most of the cleanup. I just make sure all of the cakes fired completely and get my mods put away. There's usually friends or family willing to do the rest. It's sort of become part of the "deal".

[nightstalker]

I got some cakes made by Pyro Diablo and the sales person said to take the top off because PD has heavier than normal tops. The tops do feel heavy but haven't shot or checked any yet so can't say for sure.

[jamisonlm3]

I've noticed some cakes have a piece of card stock on top. If any others did, I never noticed since they all shot fine. Some even come in boxes. Those I can imagine opening up before shooting. Then again, maybe not. There's alot of power in those shells whent hey shoot.

[mguerra]

I remove the tops just before shoot time. I'm not sure if I have ever had a cake go off prematurely due to sparks falling down in to an uncovered cake. If so, it's so uncommon I don't really care and it won't goof up the show enough to matter. If you prep your cakes well ahead by matching them or installing talons, beware of mud daubers. I used to cut three sides of the top, match the cake, put the match wire on top of the tubes and tape the top back down with a single piece of tape. Mud daubers got in there and built nests in the tubes. Now when I prep cakes ahead of time I DO NOT cut the tops off. I just tape the match or the talon on top of the cake and cut the top off at shoot time.

[AxeElf]

Mud daubers got in there and built nests in the tubes.

That must have been a great bee effect when it went off.

[displayfireworks1]

If you remove the top paper from your fireworks cakes don't rule out a falling spark of flame landing in a mortar may ignite that cake. For sure do not remove the paper from 1.3 cakes. if you ever work some professional display you will see "Finale Cakes" . These are common around the July 4th holiday when the display company has all of there mortars in service or didn't figure out the logistics of getting the mortars from one shoot site July 3rd to the next shoot site July 4th. And/or the lead shooter sets up the finale so it is an easier cleanup by removing the tops of the 1.3 finale cake.
If you look closely at a 1.3 finale cake box, they usually have an aluminum-ized cake top. Why? Because the fireworks manufactures know more than we do here in United States setting up displays. Here is what happens when you want to remove the tops of 1.3 finale cakes. That is a finale gone bad.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3Ascwn4HzE
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If you are an advanced user of any fireworks. I would not recommending remove the tops of any cake that is PART OF A FINALE.

[jamisonlm3]

I hate those covers so much. Almost with a passion They fall off so easy. On cakes, I've never thought about it being a concern. They're always folded over and taped.

[mguerra]

I should have said that on my 1.3 shows I do leave the cake tops on. Now on that video you had cross fire jumping from one mortar rack Quickmatch string to another. How? It looks like there were rows of mortar racks perpendicular to one another. I'm guessing the row coming at the camera maybe had a visco end of the string adjacent to the row that was first fired, You can see that at the exact moment the fire got to the row coming at the camera, it lit that string. Whether that was purposeful or accidental isn't clear. The crowd liked it! We cover our 1.3 finale strings with wide masking tape for two reasons. One is to keep the individual shell leaders down in the tubes, not protruding out the tops; and also to protect from spark fall. As far as cakes, a spark falling in the tube will just land on the paper disc. The spark would have to fall down between the tubes and hit a connecting fuse. On most cakes those connector fuses are covered in tape. A lot of cakes, not all, also have a cardboard tube separator near the top which can stop sparks from falling down between the tubes to the connector fuses. For consumer shows I just prefer less clean up and don't worry about spark fall, and remove the cake tops. I do cover ALL my consumer mortar rack fusing because I have had chain strings prematurely fire and lose half a show in a few seconds!!!

[SystemXpert]

I remove the tops of my 1.4 cakes before bagging them for rain protection. It saves on cleanup plus eliminates another layer to have to shoot through. I've seen some people cut an "X" on the tops and honestly I can't tell if that helps or not. Seems like the velocity still shreds the paper. As far as cross firing it doesn't seem to be a major issue, but a thin layer of paper and cellophane isn't going to offer much protection anyway. If you have items which you absolutely must protect from cross fire, you need to cover them with foil.

How do you bag your cakes? I am curious. I have mostly cakes in my show and the other items are all ready weather proofed. This is my first big show, I fear I will be outside mins away from firing and a sudden storm comes through.

[Berserker23]

You want the thinnest bags and not flex I use .9 mil store brand 13 gallon bags and what I do is I use a zip ties to close the ends and it works. also harbor freight or northern tool tarps works great but slowly remove the tarps because the rain puddles up on the center

[DavidthePyro]

I always put a post in the center, and make a "tent" so that water runs off. This does require big tarps as they're pitched for drainage but also extended far enough out that water isn't running off right next to my cakes. I usually buy plastic and then reuse in the winter to block wind on the covered part of my deck. Even when I get nice tarps, they get holes quickly. So I just go "cheap" with something I can re- purpose. I get very lucky with rain. I have this weather theory since my County is basically a plateau with big valleys to the east and west, I think it breaks storms up before hitting us.

[esgrillo]

How do you bag your cakes? I am curious. I have mostly cakes in my show and the other items are all ready weather proofed. This is my first big show, I fear I will be outside mins away from firing and a sudden storm comes through.

I tarp my entire platform with a single tarp that covers the entire area. I have survived 3"+ of rain on shoot day doing this.

[Birdman]

I did a small show last weekend with L-C-R positions. Unexpected rain came through as I started setting up. Put a tarp over everything and thought the rain would pass. No such luck. The forecast changed and rain was expected until just about dark. Spent the rest of the time on my hands and knees under the tarp setting everything up. Wasn't able to get the space I wanted between each position but nothing got wet and everyone enjoyed a dry show. Only I noticed that the show was much more "cluttered" then I wanted.

[SystemXpert]

I tarp my entire platform with a single tarp that covers the entire area. I have survived 3"+ of rain on shoot day doing this. thank you ? I am so only 25 miles away from you. I will do the same ?tarp the platforms!