Help me pick the right equipment for my Cobra starter kit

[PyroGyro]

Hey all,

I'm hoping you Cobra pros can take a look at couple of pics and based on my show layout and my equipment list, let me know if I have everything I need or not. Looking to do scripted shows. My shows have evolved into 3 position shows, LCR, with most of the effects coming from the Center unless I'm trying to fill the sky periodically throughout the show or in the finale. My last show used only 21 cues in the center position(sometimes multiple cakes per cue), with only 6 cues L + R. That said I'm thinking I need a 72M with slats for a good start and I think I'd be able to get away with this many cues for my next couple of shows. Please take a look at the attached layout and proposed equipment list and let me know if I have everything I need, whether this is the right approach, or any other comments. Thanks!

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4486&stc=1


http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4487&stc=1

[rfgonzo]

Each slat will come with 1 shunt. I would get 1 extra shunts for each slat you buy. This would be the same as twisting E match or MJG wires.

[rfgonzo]

What program did you use for your sample show layout?

[Robbro097]

I support the extra shunts are great to safely prewire. If u dont have to have the side exit case for the 72m it comes in a foam boot that is fit for the seahorse 300 case that sells for around 30$ u can also get same case and cut the factory foam that come with it to fit the remote. Looks like your set. 4488 4489

[cptnding]

My shows are similar in size. My advice would be buy 4 18Ms instead of the 72. Might cost more up front but makes it easier on set up for me. Drop the mod where you need it and avoid having to run all the cables and slats (not to mention tearing it all down and storing it after the show is over). This is why I wanted to move to wireless to begin with. Also gives your more flexibility on your show. You can move them as needed with out worrying about if your cables will make it or not.
To me the high cue count mods are best suited for pods of individually matched shells or shows with a very large frontage that would require a LOT of 18Ms.
Just my opinion and I welcome yours.

[esgrillo]

I essentially agree with cpt. I would get 2 18ms and a 36m with onboard to start. It gives you more flexibility and simplicity to start. I also have a 72m in addition to a lot of 18m and 36m but I got the 72m last. I use it in my 3 platform set up for items that I fire at the same time on 2 o 3 of the platforms so that one module is firing ~200 items.

I have a lot of slats and cables now but I still like the flexibility of the original 18m. It is also true that storing all the cables and slats is something to consider. Plus in my case I have several of the 25m CENT50 cables and lord almighty those things are HEAVY lol.

[PyroGyro]

What program did you use for your sample show layout? Powerpoint

[PyroGyro]

I support the extra shunts are great to safely prewire. If u dont have to have the side exit case for the 72m it comes in a foam boot that is fit for the seahorse 300 case that sells for around 30$ u can also get same case and cut the factory foam that come with it to fit the remote. Looks like your set. 4488 4489

Interesting way to save a good amount of money and I'd almost be inclined to go this way but with your 72M case you cannot close the cover during the shoot right? Could explain why your unit looks so dirty?

[PyroGyro]

I essentially agree with cpt. I would get 2 18ms and a 36m with onboard to start. It gives you more flexibility and simplicity to start. I also have a 72m in addition to a lot of 18m and 36m but I got the 72m last. I use it in my 3 platform set up for items that I fire at the same time on 2 o 3 of the platforms so that one module is firing ~200 items.

I have a lot of slats and cables now but I still like the flexibility of the original 18m. It is also true that storing all the cables and slats is something to consider. Plus in my case I have several of the 25m CENT50 cables and lord almighty those things are HEAVY lol.

Hmm this is a difficult choice. Part of the reason I decided to go with the 72M is because with less modules you're dealing with less module problems. 1 module to sync, 1 module to test etc... Also, I saw Rick from Tampa post something somewhere about how it was stupid for him to have bought a bunch of modules and instead should've gone the slat route with modules with more cue capacity. Further, your idea works good for the 18M but for the 36M I can see having 36 ematch running to it being a mess, not to mention that with that many ematch going to one location, fireworks have to be closer to the unit, unless you squib etc or use slats... Basically it seems like either option would be a wash money wise due to not needing to buy slats and other stuff. UGH 1st world decisions! Part of me still wants to go the 72M slat route. I get what you're saying about the cable storage and cable weight too. I have experience in live sound reinforcement so I know what it is to lug around 100ft 16 channel XLR snakes... (16 channels, 3 wires per channel, 2 XLR connectors per channel) Pretty damn heavy. I wonder what those 82ft DB25cables weigh? Are they unbearable? Maybe I will email Cobra and ask. If they're so heavy and bulky that it's a real pain I'll have to consider this more carefully. Do you have a picture of a rolled up 25M cable you could post?

[PyroGyro]

Btw, if going slats should I go mini slats, or full sized slats? Advantages/disadvantages? I see that the mini slat is smaller and cheaper, but is it a PITA trying to wire it? Last, I have to say these quicklpugs look enticing, except when wanting to trigger multiple cakes from one cue...I guess you'd have to squib the quickplug ematches somehow to get around this issue?

[esgrillo]

(16 channels, 3 wires per channel, 2 XLR connectors per channel) Pretty damn heavy. I wonder what those 82ft DB25cables weigh? Are they unbearable? Maybe I will email Cobra and ask. If they're so heavy and bulky that it's a real pain I'll have to consider this more carefully. Do you have a picture of a rolled up 25M cable you could post?

LOL it is CENT50.... not DB25... they are about twice as thick. I did a test on them a couple years ago on youtube. I will link.

Agreed you need to be space conscious with a 36m and your platform but I always use the 5m or 6m ematch so it not a problem.

My 2019 show shows a lot of the mods in the set up and I do have a lot of slats as well.

Plus if you do a small show, grab an 18m... plop it out there, wire and shoot. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCLfqlD-McU

[esgrillo]

Powerpoint

try draw.io

free and good

4490

[PyroGyro]

LOL it is CENT50.... not DB25... they are about twice as thick. I did a test on them a couple years ago on youtube. I will link.

Agreed you need to be space conscious with a 36m and your platform but I always use the 5m or 6m ematch so it not a problem.

My 2019 show shows a lot of the mods in the set up and I do have a lot of slats as well.

Plus if you do a small show, grab an 18m... plop it out there, wire and shoot. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCLfqlD-McU


If I go with the 72M and slats, I'm going with the 72M with 18S slats which are DB25, vs. 36S slats which uses the Centronic 50 pin. Btw, thanks for posting that video. Those 25M Centronics cables are nothing to me. The cables I'm used to lugging around are almost twice as thick, and are about 20ft longer so I don't really see it as a big issue. As for doing a small show I can grab the 72M, 1 18s, and a short 5M cable too, which to me doesn't sound like too big of a deal. Btw, I see you are using parallel slats? I was going to go Series for more ematch per cue but why wouldn't I want to go series?

[rfgonzo]

Btw, if going slats should I go mini slats, or full sized slats? Advantages/disadvantages? I see that the mini slat is smaller and cheaper, but is it a PITA trying to wire it? Last, I have to say these quicklpugs look enticing, except when wanting to trigger multiple cakes from one cue...I guess you'd have to squib the quickplug ematches somehow to get around this issue?

Mini slats are the way to go IMO. Not at all a PITA

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Also, I saw Rick from Tampa post something somewhere about how it was stupid for him to have bought a bunch of modules and instead should've gone the slat route with modules with more cue capacity.

Let me clarify what I was saying there. I already had four 18M's and I wanted to spread out my show. But instead of buying slats and 50' cables, I went and bought eight more 18M's! Quite a big price difference. Now, having said that, I really like the 18M's over the 72's. I'm not at a point where I'm going to have that much going on at one consolidated point where I need a 72M. But now I can run a slat off any 1 of my 12 18M's and put effects all over the shoot site without needing long runs of cables running back to a central 72M. Does that make sense? Basically, IMHO anyway, the 18M's give you more flexibility to spread your show out than the 72 or 36M's do.


Btw, if going slats should I go mini slats, or full sized slats? Advantages/disadvantages? I see that the mini slat is smaller and cheaper, but is it a PITA trying to wire it? Last, I have to say these quicklpugs look enticing, except when wanting to trigger multiple cakes from one cue...I guess you'd have to squib the quickplug ematches somehow to get around this issue?

The mini slats have holes in the corners so you can screw them down to your boards or mount them to racks. The quick-plugs are awesome! I got to play with them at PGI this year. Very easy to install and tear down. Really speeds up the wiring process. You'll like them a lot. The ONLY drawback is if you want to wire in series. But you can still cut the initiator and wire into a pigtail and you're good to go. Not really a show-stopper.

[PyroGyro]

Let me clarify what I was saying there. I already had four 18M's and I wanted to spread out my show. But instead of buying slats and 50' cables, I went and bought eight more 18M's! Quite a big price difference. Now, having said that, I really like the 18M's over the 72's. I'm not at a point where I'm going to have that much going on at one consolidated point where I need a 72M. But now I can run a slat off any 1 of my 12 18M's and put effects all over the shoot site without needing long runs of cables running back to a central 72M. Does that make sense? Basically, IMHO anyway, the 18M's give you more flexibility to spread your show out than the 72 or 36M's do.



The mini slats have holes in the corners so you can screw them down to your boards or mount them to racks. The quick-plugs are awesome! I got to play with them at PGI this year. Very easy to install and tear down. Really speeds up the wiring process. You'll like them a lot. The ONLY drawback is if you want to wire in series. But you can still cut the initiator and wire into a pigtail and you're good to go. Not really a show-stopper.


I'm starting to understand more about the flexibility with the 18M's. specifically in that you have more freedom to spread out your show, and don't have all these cable runs. That said I think for now I'm still going to go the 72M and 18s slat route initially. I think in the foreseeable future, my show setups, whether they are club shoots, or my own private shows, will be 3 stations LCR as described above. If and when I expand, I'll start adding 18Ms.

As for the quickplugs I saw them in action at a club shoot a couple of weeks ago and yeah, it's faster and less of a tangled mess at the module. As far as any series wiring/pigtailing goes, you can simply keep some non quickplug ignitors around to wire them in series and then you'll only need to cut the 1 quickplug ignitor to wire them all together. The only thing that really sux about them is once you go quickplug you're stuck with buying your ignitors from Cobra right? Anyway, I think that I'm actually going to go the 18s quickplug mini slat route now. They're smaller, super cheap, and if one of them fails I'm not breaking the bank to replace it, never mind I can buy spares too without hitting my wallet hard.

[Deanbc]

I did my first pyromusical AND Cobra fired show last July 4th. Thinking like you one of the first modules I bought was a 72M with the slats and another 72m with onboard cues. If I had to do it all over again, knowing what I know now, I probably would have purchased multiple 18M’s and placed them accordingly. The cables are a pain to use, clean and store. You are going to have match wires running everywhere so that’s not an issue. There is a place for 72M’s but with your proposed layout I would get the required 18ms. Also, you can also add slats to the 18M’s using a conversation kit or even at time of purchase.

[RoosterWalt]

I'm a beginner and I bought the remote, the audio box, and 2 18M's with onboard terminals to start. I did my first show this year on the 4th. What I learned was:

The equipment all gets REALLY dirty... (I know that's part of the game... but, some of the Chinese stuff I used didn't just get dirty it all started rusting. So, I feel like keeping the equipment clean isn't just about looks... it' about keeping it working well) so to me, the less "equipment" out there exposed the better...

But... I also figured out that more 18 boxes might be better than 1 big box because then you can position them closer to the fireworks. You can then use shorter igniters so less wires running everywhere. I could see that with my little 2.5K show there was A LOT of wires and if I had more que's it would just get more and more hard to manage quickly and I'm figuring the longer the wires the more of a pain it could be. Think about how a long rope is harder to manage than a short rope.

Now, I did have thoughts that for a big comet rack - a 36 or 72 could be worthwhile if I was gonna shoot that many comets all from the same rack - but, if they were spread across 3 launch pads far away from another... then back to the multiple 18's.

All in all, I think that it is sort of a "it all depends" but, I'm of the "more modules is more flexible" camp.

[PyroGyro]

I did my first pyromusical AND Cobra fired show last July 4th. Thinking like you one of the first modules I bought was a 72M with the slats and another 72m with onboard cues. If I had to do it all over again, knowing what I know now, I probably would have purchased multiple 18M?s and placed them accordingly. The cables are a pain to use, clean and store. You are going to have match wires running everywhere so that?s not an issue. There is a place for 72M?s but with your proposed layout I would get the required 18ms. Also, you can also add slats to the 18M?s using a conversation kit or even at time of purchase.


Thanks for your input. I keep hearing over and over again not to go the route I want to go and I'm not really seeing the big benefit of going with 1 36M and 2 18M's, but since everyone is so adamant about it, maybe I should just follow the advice. Maybe I should go with 1 36M with the quickplug slat option with short 5M cables for my center position, or I could just go 36M onboard quickplug, and then with go 2 18M onboard quickplug for the L and R positions. The sucky part of going this way though is it's going to cost more, but I'll do a price compare and figure out if it's too much.

[PyroGyro]

OK so I've done the financial analysis of going with (1) 36M with onboard quickplugs, (2) 18M's with onboard quickplugs, armored cases for each, and with everything else I want to buy it's only $100 more than my original configuration proposal which is no big deal. I think I'm sold on this new config now. Thanks for all the help!