Started building my Type 4 Outdoor Magazine!!!

[PAClark]

Well, taking ideas from Bazerk, I pulled the trigger and started building my outdoor magazine yesterday. It's about 320 feet from the house....so storage is oh plenty. Since it's in the woodline, I'll have to trim any trees < 10' or brush down further for a 25 ft. radius. This is a pretty high ground area and I still put the building up on 4x4 posts with a 2x6" base. I put gravel/river rock in the flooring as the material between the wood floor and ground. Concrete seemed like some overkill. It's an 8'x8'x8' size magazine.

Here are some pics of the work so far. I'm going to use metal over the building and roof like Bazerk for the outside and build my door the same. I will be using the ATF 1/4" lock hoods that I was able to find on Amazon... They came with locks, so it was a good deal.

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4328&stc=1 http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4329&stc=1http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4330&stc=1

[esgrillo]

Well, taking ideas from Bazerk, I pulled the trigger and started building my outdoor magazine yesterday. It's about 320 feet from the house....so storage is oh plenty. Since it's in the woodline, I'll have to trim any trees < 10' or brush down further for a 25 ft. radius. This is a pretty high ground area and I still put the building up on 4x4 posts with a 2x6" base. I put gravel/river rock in the flooring as the material between the wood floor and ground. Concrete seemed like some overkill. It's an 8'x8'x8' size magazine.

Here are some pics of the work so far. I'm going to use metal over the building and roof like Bazerk for the outside and build my door the same. I will be using the ATF 1/4" lock hoods that I was able to find on Amazon... They came with locks, so it was a good deal.

4328 43294330

very nice!

[Rick_In_Tampa]

You're well past the point where I'd have to write a check, so good on ya! Looks great to me!

[Bazerk]

Dude! I am glad that my post was enough to help inspire you bro. You are definitely on the right track and you will be extremely happy that you have control of your own magazine and storage. Take photos along the way and keep them. I submitted mine with my application so that there was no question as to how it was constructed and what materials were used.

[PAClark]

You're well past the point where I'd have to write a check, so good on ya! Looks great to me!

You're not alone Rick... As hot as it is out there....I was tempted to just write that check and get a 20' shipping container!

[PAClark]

Dude! I am glad that my post was enough to help inspire you bro. You are definitely on the right track and you will be extremely happy that you have control of your own magazine and storage. Take photos along the way and keep them. I submitted mine with my application so that there was no question as to how it was constructed and what materials were used.

Thank you! Seeing how much it cost and your quality build... definite inspiration to go for it. We build a lot of outbuildings, and whatever we need out here on the property. I would have gotten further today, but ran out of wood! I'll get more pics and keep you posted. When it's all said and done, I would imagine about the same cost -- $850.00-900.00 for the materials. I'm going with hunter green metal as it will be hidden a bit in the woodline.

[cherrybomb1]

Sweet! Add a second level and you’d have a nice deer stand Lol!just a pipe dream the ATF would never go for it.What State our you in?

[PAClark]

Sweet! Add a second level and you’d have a nice deer stand Lol!just a pipe dream the ATF would never go for it.What State our you in?

I'm in Arkansas. A second level would be pretty awesome.

[chriskrc]

Looking good can't wait to see the finished product. Awesome job so far.

[kevinwetzel]

I've been seeing quite a few people building shed like buildings for their "outdoor" type 4 and wanted to share a picture of my outdoor type 4 to maybe give another perspective.

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4334&stc=1
http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4335&stc=1

This was approved by ATF at 1000lbs although the local fire marshal limited me to 50lbs of composition and only 1.4 because it was in a residential neighborhood even though there are no rules against having magazines in the code.

Just thought maybe this would help somebody else out there as the ATF considered this an outdoor magazine.

And yes I had to clean the vegetation around the magazine prior to approval and keep it clear for 25 ft.

[PAClark]

I've been seeing quite a few people building shed like buildings for their "outdoor" type 4 and wanted to share a picture of my outdoor type 4 to maybe give another perspective.

4334
4335

This was approved by ATF at 1000lbs although the local fire marshal limited me to 50lbs of composition and only 1.4 because it was in a residential neighborhood even though there are no rules against having magazines in the code.

Just thought maybe this would help somebody else out there as the ATF considered this an outdoor magazine.

And yes I had to clean the vegetation around the magazine prior to approval and keep it clear for 25 ft.


Very nice and I had seen your build previously. I just happen to go big with everything.... hence the reason I am going for the 1.3 g display fireworks ;-) Some of the 1.3 cakes I would like are a bit bulky, and I didn't want to be limited by storage space. Too bad they limited you to 1.4.... Can they do that even though the ATF signed off?

[kevinwetzel]

They can but I’ve got options and am working on 2 additional storage locations. Local authorities can be more restrictive but not less restrictive. Although they have nothing on the books to prevent anything. I am careful where I choose to battle. My relationship with local code officials is good and I would rather keep it that way. They will lose thousands in tax revenue annually because of that decision. I’m OK with that too!

[MidwestPyrotechnics]

PACClark/bazerk, these are awesome. I live in a neighborhood right now so a magazine is out of the question for me. I’m planning to buy property within the next year or two. When I do I’m definitely looking back on both of your projects to design and build my own!

[PAClark]

PACClark/bazerk, these are awesome. I live in a neighborhood right now so a magazine is out of the question for me. I’m planning to buy property within the next year or two. When I do I’m definitely looking back on both of your projects to design and build my own!

It just takes a little elbow grease, and is much cheaper than a shipping container with conversion! I should be done this weekend (weather pending) and will post my pics. Hard to believe it's only taken 1 week for the build!! I have the roof and metal done and will have to build the door and put my lock hoods on likely tonight. I work full time and have to work this project in the evenings/weekend.

[MidwestPyrotechnics]

It just takes a little elbow grease, and is much cheaper than a shipping container with conversion! I should be done this weekend (weather pending) and will post my pics. Hard to believe it's only taken 1 week for the build!! I have the roof and metal done and will have to build the door and put my lock hoods on likely tonight. I work full time and have to work this project in the evenings/weekend.

Question for you/bazerk if you don’t mind me asking. I noticed bazerk used the “puck”style lock with a hidden shackle. Would you still need the hoods when using these versus a standard five pin lock?

[Bazerk]

Question for you/bazerk if you don’t mind me asking. I noticed bazerk used the “puck”style lock with a hidden shackle. Would you still need the hoods when using these versus a standard five pin lock?

You do not need the hoods if you use the puck style luck with a hidden shackle. I wanted to avoid any welding so I opted for those.

[PAClark]

Question for you/bazerk if you don?t mind me asking. I noticed bazerk used the ?puck?style lock with a hidden shackle. Would you still need the hoods when using these versus a standard five pin lock?

I had read in the ATF 2012 guidelines that you could use the "puck style" lock mechanism, though it may require prior approval. I just chose the 1/4 hoods and found them on Amazon for $80.00 each with lock included. I have pics as I installed them today and made some progress on the build. I'm 1 week in and hopefully will have it done in a few more days. Not bad for a few hours work each evening and this a.m.

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4351&stc=1

[PAClark]

Question for you/bazerk if you don?t mind me asking. I noticed bazerk used the ?puck?style lock with a hidden shackle. Would you still need the hoods when using these versus a standard five pin lock?


Ranger Lock RGLB-1L Lock Box with 1-Inch Hardened Steel Lock http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4352&stc=1

[PAClark]

Progress thus far.

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4353&stc=1http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4354&stc=1http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4355&stc=1

[displayfireworks1]

At Kevinwetzel.. Don't let whoever that is tell you that magazine is only approved for 1.4 product. My guess is that is some verbal BS he is telling you trying to impose his own impressions on you. Did the ATF place a numeric sticker on that red magazine? Usually inside on the lid. Don't tell me the number, just tell me if they officially approved it. What if anything did that local person, that is not an ATF person, give you in writing?
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At PAClark great job on the magazine. Thank you for posting the pictures. This reminds of the time when forums member Bezerk posted the same sort of pictures. I hope it inspires others.

[Bazerk]

Progress thus far.

The one thing I will tell you for sure is to make sure that you back fill, preferably with gravel, up to the sides of the walls on the outside. You cannot have any access to the underside of the mag from the outside. Looking good man, I am proud of you bro. Keep on keepin on.

[PAClark]

At Kevinwetzel.. Don't let whoever that is tell you that magazine is only approved for 1.4 product. My guess is that is some verbal BS he is telling you trying to impose his own impressions on you. Did the ATF place a numeric sticker on that red magazine? Usually inside on the lid. Don't tell me the number, just tell me if they officially approved it. What if anything did that local person, that is not an ATF person, give you in writing?
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At PAClark great job on the magazine. Thank you for posting the pictures. This reminds of the time when forums member Bezerk posted the same sort of pictures. I hope it inspires others.

Thanks Dave! It's been a lot of hard work the last 2 weekends but I'm almost done. Part of me thinks, "you're doing all this for fireworks...?" The Pyro in me then says, "Yes, Yes I am!!!" :-)

[PAClark]

The one thing I will tell you for sure is to make sure that you back fill, preferably with gravel, up to the sides of the walls on the outside. You cannot have any access to the underside of the mag from the outside. Looking good man, I am proud of you bro. Keep on keepin on.

Will do, and thanks Bazerk!! I had to complete the metal work on the door and front and I still have to get the corners on before backfilling. I got the lock hoods and padlock brackets also attached today. The metal is almost done on the front and I added 2 more hinges....that door is a BEAST and I don't think even 2 commercial hinges would be enough. I am myself in awe of the build over the last week and can't wait to fill this sucker with some 1.3!!! I have to thank my build parter, my father-in-law. He does siding for a living and is my build buddy on everything we build out here on the compound. We work hours and hours on the weekends and in the evenings after our regular jobs. I can't thank him enough for the hard work we put in to do things like this.

Here are some close ups of the 1/4" steel ATF approved lock hoods. There are some 5" and 6" carriage bolts holding these on through some thick wood. Your aren't prying these off!


Progress today.

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4359&stc=1

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4358&stc=1

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4360&stc=1
http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4361&stc=1

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Most impressive!!!

[BMoore]

Kevin - I really like your approach and I've been thinking about doing something similar. Was there any locking requirements for the outer plastic structure or is that strictly cosmetic? Is the job box anchored to anything other than the blocks to make it more permanent? I would have assumed anchoring to a concrete slab would have been necessary.

[PAClark]

Most impressive!!!

Thanks Rick! I'm on the home stretch and planning on submitting my type 54 application along with magazine application in the next week or two. I hope all goes smooth. I ordered Daves DVD's about a month ago and here we are.

[Mattp]

that is a beautiful thing!!!... i wish i had property that i can do whatever i want with... here in good ole NY i cant even order a cap gun online... i was so pissed when i found this out.. how insane is that!!... best of luck with your applications.. but looks like your well on your way

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Thanks Rick! I'm on the home stretch and planning on submitting my type 54 application along with magazine application in the next week or two. I hope all goes smooth. I ordered Daves DVD's about a month ago and here we are.

That's pretty darn good. I ordered Dave's DVD's 3 years ago and they're still sitting in the envelope they came in! You're going to be taking delivery of your first batch of 1.3G products before you know it. Looking forward to video of your first shoot!

[kevinwetzel]

Sorry so slow to respond. The outside is purely cosmetic. The outside has no locking requirements as the job box provides the hooded locks. Under the magazine I pit a concrete anchor and chained the magazine to the concrete block that is impossible to remove from the ground with the magazine in place. The exterior provides great weather protection and the chain underneath keeps the thing from floating away in the event of a flood. I'll try and get some pictures of the underside showing how it locks in place.


Kevin - I really like your approach and I've been thinking about doing something similar. Was there any locking requirements for the outer plastic structure or is that strictly cosmetic? Is the job box anchored to anything other than the blocks to make it more permanent? I would have assumed anchoring to a concrete slab would have been necessary.

[kevinwetzel]

At Kevinwetzel.. Don't let whoever that is tell you that magazine is only approved for 1.4 product. My guess is that is some verbal BS he is telling you trying to impose his own impressions on you. Did the ATF place a numeric sticker on that red magazine? Usually inside on the lid. Don't tell me the number, just tell me if they officially approved it. What if anything did that local person, that is not an ATF person, give you in writing?
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At PAClark great job on the magazine. Thank you for posting the pictures. This reminds of the time when forums member Bezerk posted the same sort of pictures. I hope it inspires others.


Dave,
Yes the magazine is approved but the local authorities here do not understand that 50lbs of comp is 50lbs of comp and will behave the same way regardless of what category it is rated for transportation. As I mentioned I have a huge project about to kickoff in my neighboring County that will allow me to store what I need so I'm not fighting for it but the county will realize the errors or there ways when the neighboring counties end up with all of my tax revenue because they choose to support my business. The ATF paperwork says display fireworks are fine, it's the local County that is not informed or very supportive when it comes to things they do not understand. What they don't realize is that they made this decision out of irrational fear so as with any vendor that I don't like, I'll take my business elsewhere, literally. When I'm generating millions in sales they will be sorry for that decision.

Irrational fear is costly! I have more than enough separation with the table of distances. The ATF tried to tell him that it didn't matter but it's nothing in my overall plans. Not worth the fight this time. I've got options in the my County.

[PAClark]

All done today. The heat lately had me off the project as it was just too much. I was able to finish her up today. I put rubber door stripping to seal the door and beefed up the bottom with another 2x6. We finished the metal work on the corners and roof. I added the backfill and I put spray on bedliner on all the countersunk deck screws on the inside. I have pictures printed off, my fingerprint cards, and passport photo. I made a plat map from google maps and have everything labeled with distances. I should be able to mail it off this next week. Wish me luck!!http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4418&stc=1 http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4419&stc=1

[cherrybomb1]

You Nailed it!...Literally

[PyroManiacs]

Looks great! Good job!

[PAClark]

Looks great! Good job!

Thank you! However, looking at the pic --- I just realized the door jam and periphery of the inner aspect of the door are covered with aluminum. I'm betting I need to cover those with bedliner as well, as they would be exposed to the inside when the door is closed. I don't want any hiccups in the process. We wrapped the periphery of the door in aluminum and then placed the metal roofing/siding for weatherproofing.

[Bazerk]

I was going to say that. I kept my jams wood for that reason. its eerie how similar it looks to mine man. Looks awesome and congrats. I am sure it will pass without any issues.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Awesome job!! Looks great.

[PAClark]

I was going to say that. I kept my jams wood for that reason. its eerie how similar it looks to mine man. Looks awesome and congrats. I am sure it will pass without any issues.

Thanks Bazerk....I may have used your design ideas with pics of your building on my phone as I was constructing it. ;-)

[PAClark]

Awesome job!! Looks great.

Thanks Rick!

[displayfireworks1]

Thanks for posting the pictures. It looks great, you do nice work. I'm curious are you left handed?

[PAClark]

Thanks for posting the pictures. It looks great, you do nice work. I'm curious are you left handed?

Thank you Dave! No, I'm right handed... what tipped you to favor me being a lefty? BTW, I sprayed the aluminum inside the door with rubber undercoating tonight for the finish.... so I thought$#%$#@ It ran off like butter. I've never seen anything like it. I scraped it off and will have to prime it first. Who knew....

[PAClark]

WELL, IT'S OFFICIALLY 17 IN ARKANSAS!!! I received my license in the mail today! Woohoooo!!! A bit of hard work on the magazine, paperwork, interview and some time went into it. The inspectors loved the magazine and had NO issues with the build. They approved me for up to 10,000 Lbs.....as if I could ever reach that limit. I am very happy to enter this next stage and excited to be part of the 1.3g club. I'd like to personally thank Dave and Ark Pyro for all their help and advise throughout the process. Having an experienced/licensed person to consult and advise you through the process helps a great deal!

[PyroKing31]

CONGRATULATIONS! 10k lbs. NICE!

I will be building something similar when I start the 54 process. Thanks for the build guide!

[PAClark]

CONGRATULATIONS! 10k lbs. NICE!

I will be building something similar when I start the 54 process. Thanks for the build guide!

You're welcome! They had no issue with the magazine and were very informative on avoiding issues. Like avoiding plastic shelving etc to avoid static discharge. They were pretty helpful. I bought the 1/4" hoods off Amazon and they came with locks included. I also got the hinges from Home Depot..Mortise hinges with non-removable pins --- keep your receipts for those. The ATF wanted to ensure the hinges had non-removable pins and researched it on the spot. I sprayed each countersunk screw with bedliner as well. I hope it was a good step by step.

[Arclight]

I had a somewhat similar experience on my Type II magazine. "I could probably make this work with 150lbs of product, but it would really help if they were willing to sign off on 300lbs." Then they told me at the inspection that the site was legal for 9,000lbs, LOL.



WELL, IT'S OFFICIALLY 17 IN ARKANSAS!!! I received my license in the mail today! Woohoooo!!! A bit of hard work on the magazine, paperwork, interview and some time went into it. The inspectors loved the magazine and had NO issues with the build. They approved me for up to 10,000 Lbs.....as if I could ever reach that limit. I am very happy to enter this next stage and excited to be part of the 1.3g club. I'd like to personally thank Dave and Ark Pyro for all their help and advise throughout the process. Having an experienced/licensed person to consult and advise you through the process helps a great deal!

[cherrybomb1]

WELL, IT'S OFFICIALLY 17 IN ARKANSAS!!! I received my license in the mail today! Woohoooo!!! A bit of hard work on the magazine, paperwork, interview and some time went into it. The inspectors loved the magazine and had NO issues with the build. They approved me for up to 10,000 Lbs.....as if I could ever reach that limit. I am very happy to enter this next stage and excited to be part of the 1.3g club. I'd like to personally thank Dave and Ark Pyro for all their help and advise throughout the process. Having an experienced/licensed person to consult and advise you through the process helps a great deal!
Congrats on the 54 permit...i guess perseverance really does payoff.. its got to be a pretty neat feeling your one of only 17 people in the state of Arkansas to have a 54 permit...Good luck and be safe!

[zargnut]

Thanks, this is helpful.. I was looking to just put the job box outside... is the rubbermaid enclosure required? I was looking at the 60" RIDGID box, so not sure I will find a similar enclosure to fit.




I've been seeing quite a few people building shed like buildings for their "outdoor" type 4 and wanted to share a picture of my outdoor type 4 to maybe give another perspective.

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4334&stc=1
http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=4335&stc=1

This was approved by ATF at 1000lbs although the local fire marshal limited me to 50lbs of composition and only 1.4 because it was in a residential neighborhood even though there are no rules against having magazines in the code.

Just thought maybe this would help somebody else out there as the ATF considered this an outdoor magazine.

And yes I had to clean the vegetation around the magazine prior to approval and keep it clear for 25 ft.

[kevinwetzel]

Thanks, this is helpful.. I was looking to just put the job box outside... is the rubbermaid enclosure required? I was looking at the 60" RIDGID box, so not sure I will find a similar enclosure to fit.

The enclosure is not required however it will keep the job box from rusting and will help keep moisture out of your product. I would recommend doing an indoor if your gonna use a job box unless you go this route or something similar. The seals won?t keep out all the moisture so covering it like I did will help and I put in a 5lb moisture pack but you could also throw 5lbs of rice in there to keep moisture down.

[lostpup]

I know I'm reviving an old thread. Starting the process of building my own magazine and have settled on the idea like Bazerk, and PACKARD. What I'm not seeing is how did you vent it? Type 4 is what I'm looking to construct. I believe the requirements are pretty straight foward and I can meet them with my knowledge. But I'm not seeing a vent. I would think it needs to be coated non sparking on inside and animal proofed from outside. Any tips or how to that have worked for others.

[displayfireworks1]

I'm glad you brought this older thread back. Those pictures are sure fun to look at. It pleases me to see fireworks enthusiast over the years that shared their success stories with obtaining the ATF license and approved storage. I get frustrated from time to time and need to see and hear these success situations to keep me going. I'm glad to see you used the forums search function to do your homework. I see you are from Illinois, see my previous post on your other thread.
On a side note, I am finding that the ATF Inspectors are feeling more comfortable with free standing explosive storage in those states that have less than 50 ATF User of Display Fireworks license. The problem is those states may perceive it differently. My impression is the ATF Inspectors in those low explosive license districts (notice I did not say states) have no experience in explosive storage and error on keep it separate and safer.

[Arclight]

All of the vents I have seen are just an opening that is too small to reach a hand into, covered with screen material. Or you could do a pipe at the top with a rain-proof top.

[lostpup]

Having done roofing as a side job for several years. A thru the roof vent is very possible yet a real pain in the ass with metal.i am wondering about a standard roof vent below the ridge cap and leave a small gap in ceiling or if it need to be something more extravagant. Luckily my state guy seems very knowledgeable and willing to help me get it right. We actually have a fair amount of explosives mags in the area for oil field work. They fall under the same licenses as well as our gravel pits that blast.