The beginning of my new hobby

[hypothesis]

Hello everyone. So i have finally learned how to navigate the site better, and have read alot of information. I have chosen to start at making black powder as all things pyro tend to start there as well. I have obtained all the necessary ingredients and have made about 1lb in 3 different batches. They all burn great and lift dummy shells, but am still working on charge to weight ratio as I'm not sure what my shells are going to weigh yet.
My first batch of BP was neanderthal late at night using no binder and a spaghetti strainer, but it dried got pretty hard and burned faster than my expectations. The next day i wanted harder BP so i found many had baked fresh corn starch and i did that to get dextrin. Then i made the appropriate meshed screens from scratch for pushing my potatoes through and drying. Mixed my second batch with 2% dextrin and before that dried i made a third batch with 8% dextrin... think that was to much what a messy potato!
Next i am building a tumbler to grow stars. That's how i did it 20 years ago so I'm going to try to duplicate that experience. Does anyone still use this method? I believe we used rape seed a mist of water and adding comp. Water comp. Water so on to appropriate size. I should prolly have broke this up in different sections of the forum so ill stop there. Open to feedback good or bad. Thanks

[zzzybil]

rice hulls seems to be the favorite tho cotton seeds was a topic lately ''defuzzin'' anyways - I 'm justa browser really - soooooooooo much to learn before I'd make the jump from 1.4 to the whole mag , insurance, permits keeps me at a distance . Shame it's not a simple matter of a 54 where I live

[vegassalute]

Hello everyone. So i have finally learned how to navigate the site better, and have read alot of information. I have chosen to start at making black powder as all things pyro tend to start there as well. I have obtained all the necessary ingredients and have made about 1lb in 3 different batches. They all burn great and lift dummy shells, but am still working on charge to weight ratio as I'm not sure what my shells are going to weigh yet.
My first batch of BP was neanderthal late at night using no binder and a spaghetti strainer, but it dried got pretty hard and burned faster than my expectations. The next day i wanted harder BP so i found many had baked fresh corn starch and i did that to get dextrin. Then i made the appropriate meshed screens from scratch for pushing my potatoes through and drying. Mixed my second batch with 2% dextrin and before that dried i made a third batch with 8% dextrin... think that was to much what a messy potato!
Next i am building a tumbler to grow stars. That's how i did it 20 years ago so I'm going to try to duplicate that experience. Does anyone still use this method? I believe we used rape seed a mist of water and adding comp. Water comp. Water so on to appropriate size. I should prolly have broke this up in different sections of the forum so ill stop there. Open to feedback good or bad. Thanks

Did you try the baseball test yet? How much time did you get from the lift test?

[Kenny East]

If i roll stars i usually start with a prill of either ammonia nitrate or potassium nitrate... But I've also used bird seed to start stars. Sometimes i use a small pumped or cut star as a starter. As for dextrin in bp, 1-3% by weight... 8% should be similar to concrete, lol. Typically lift is 11% of shell weight, the last 3" timed report shell i made with a bottom shot weighed 270grams... Used 30 grams of lift for it. Made quite a noise leaving the tube.. The ratio of lift to shel weight drops after a certain size, not 100% on what size, think it's 8" I don't usually do any over 3"

[Kenny East]

Bp is a good place to start, then tiger tail stars

[hypothesis]

I will be getting some 1/4"thick 3"steel tubes from a friend this weekend then i can try the timed lift test. I have a welder and some 1/2"flat stock i will use for a plug. Any concerns with that assuming i put a good weld on things? Also the 8%dextrin mix is hard as a rock! And slower than the 2%mix which seems hard enough to me further testing once i get my tubes set up will help with that.

[hypothesis]

Also what type of container do you guys prefer to store your mixed compositions, stars and BP in?

[vegassalute]

Also what type of container do you guys prefer to store your mixed compositions, stars and BP in?

I use plastic containers of various sizes from Ace hardware, along with lids. And I segregate storage by class.

[Kenny East]

I've got plastic containers with snap down lids and silicone gaskets... Store my chemicals in either 5 gallon buckets or plastic ammo cans.

[Kenny East]

As for shooting out of steel, I've never done it... Hdpe, fiberglass or cardboard for shell testing... Don't want to wreck a good tube on a cato. If you're going to do it, might suggest that you barricade your tubes or burry it.

[hypothesis]

Ok well my friend with the pipe came through but they're about 2 1/4" ID and roughly 3/16"thick. Luckily i have unlimited access to various sizes of cardboard tubing through my work. I have some 2"OD tubing i made up 4"long cans @50,75,and 100 gram weights. Dummies with filler in them and lift only. I only got to shoot the 50 gram before it started raining, but it went well over the trees prolly 60' with 6 grams of lift. For my 1st try ill call that success and tomorrow will do some real testing.
Kenny east... what is a CATO?

[hypothesis]

Oh ya i brought my dummies out to 2 1/8" and my tube is cut to 20"

[hypothesis]

Ok so I'm@ 5 seconds air time with a 10% lift and 6 seconds with a 11% lift charge. Looks like about 50-60' high i think it needs to be a touch higher any thoughts?

[Kenny East]

Catastrophe at take off... Basically when a shell blows inside a mortar, when a rocket explodes on the launch pad... Stuff like that... Those are Cato's... As for your tests, sounds like your bp may be a bit slow. Make sure that your total shell weight for lift charge calculation is accurate, then try again... Also what type of charcoal did you use to make your bp? If your next test isn't higher i would suggest trying a higher amount of lift... Only a few more percent of total shell weight, like 15%. Is your air time for the whole time that your shell is in the air, or until it hits apogee? The highest point in it's upward flight.

[hypothesis]

Air time was done from lift off til it hit the ground. My total shell weight was low and that made my lift around 9% i added weight when i finished wrapping the shell after i put the lift charge in so I'm guna do some more testing... ill get it.
My charcoal is simply airfloat of various types of hardwoods both it and my KNO3 have been ball milled. I think my charge was simply to light. My testing was again cut short by rain. Plus I'm working 2nd shift so I miss out on half my daytime as well.

[hypothesis]

My BP is made through a 4 mesh screen so it's about 1/4" square by 1/8" thick. Maybe that's too big?

[Big Mark]

For much hotter BP you might wont to try a charcoal made from a soft wood like Eastern red cedar works very good.
And it is very easy to make your self. Just buy a bag of pet bedding at Walmart. Then hope on over to you tube and look at how to make charcoal and your in there. And I would try a 8 mesh screen the next time. Good luck

[Kenny East]

Yeah, you may want to look into a different charcoal, mixed hardwood is good for certain stars, fountains, and rockets... But for the better lift and burst, you want a softer wood with little pitch... Willow, poplar, birch, balsa, cedar. As for the size of the granules, for a 2.25" shell you would be best to make smaller granules. The bp i use for 3" shells is usually smaller than average cat litter.... My preferred method for granulating is to press my bp into a cylinder shaped pellet, let it dry and crush/crack it down into the size i want... Looks like this when it's done....

2606

[hypothesis]

Ok soo i made a new batch of lift. Granulated to about 3mm or a 1/10" half the size of my previous test lift, and much beter results. Lifting a 60 gm canister for 6.8 seconds. With 7 gms of lift 15"tube. Obviously I cant measure the height, but it is well high enough for safety.

[Kenny East]

There is a tool for measuring height, it's used mostly for rocketry but it could be used for measuring the height of any object... Made by Estes... Kinda looks like a cross between a protractor and a pistol. Glad the smaller grain size worked better

[hypothesis]

So i have a question about a storage concern. It is in regards to a 22lr sensitive exploding target. I have been making and storing this mixture at the location in which i shoot them for prolly 7 years now. The longest i have stored the mixed comp is about a year n a half. Locked in a safe with firearms and ammunition. My concern, after learning more about this comp by reading on this forum, is the shelf life or safety/ danger factor from decomposition of said comp in storage. The comp has always worked even after long periods of storage. I would like to list what the comp is made of to allow you guys to voice your opinions/ concerns of storage. I'm just not sure if it's ok to list here because it's probably a very questionable/sensitive comp. With your permission i would like to tell you the recipe and see what your thoughts are on me storing this and how bad of an idea it is. or isn't? I have made this comp safely for over 7 years it will detonate @<1gm and even a sub sonic round will do the trick! I want to remind my concern is the shelf life of this recipe. As always im open to criticism concerns and warnings cant hurt a responsible persons feelings.

[displayfireworks1]

I see your question, you can list your ingredients. I have a feeling I know what they are, there are a few out there. Why even store it all , use it up. I have a question, is the place where they are stored and the place where you shoot them involve driving on the road between the two locations with the mixed product ?

[hypothesis]

The recipe is:
Pot. Chlorate 12
Dark al 3
Sulfar 3
+100-325 at. Al 2
After learning more about the ingredients in this recipe i don't think i want to store them at all. There were occasions were our shoot may have been cut short by weather or other reasons so we stored what wasn't shot. They are always delivered to the location un-mixed. For your question not even once, they are always hand delivered down range. My max range there is 200yds and we don't even own an atv so ya we walked them to there final location.
*edited for safety THIS RECIPE IS EXTREMELY IMPACT SENSITIVE AND I'M NOT SAYING IT'S SAFE FOR ANYONE TO USE.

[PyroJoeNEPA]

The recipe is:
Pot. Chlorate 12
Dark al 3
Sulfar 3
+100-325 at. Al 2
After learning more about the ingredients in this recipe i don't think i want to store them at all. There were occasions were our shoot may have been cut short by weather or other reasons so we stored what wasn't shot. They are always delivered to the location un-mixed. For your question not even once, they are always hand delivered down range. My max range there is 200yds and we don't even own an atv so ya we walked them to there final location.
*edited for safety THIS RECIPE IS EXTREMELY IMPACT SENSITIVE AND I'M NOT SAYING IT'S SAFE FOR ANYONE TO USE.

Your formula is a very sensitive flash powder mix similar to Shimizu's Thunder #3 flash. Not something you want to be storing.
You would be better off using an Ammonium Nitrate[prilled]/Aluminum formula for your exploding targets..[90-95% AN to 10-5%AL] and is much safer to handle/store/use than the chlorate based flash mixture you have been using.

[hypothesis]

I do use 95AN 5AL for my normal rifle targets. This was a question about my 22 LR sensitive target recipe. I was sure what the answer would be just wanted some opinions.

[PyroJoeNEPA]

I do use 95AN 5AL for my normal rifle targets. This was a question about my 22 LR sensitive target recipe. I was sure what the answer would be just wanted some opinions.

Your chlorate mix as listed earlier would work well with the lower velocity rounds as I am sure you have found out. It is a pretty sensitive mix--the sulfur makes the chlorate a little "less aggressive" but in doing so it also increases the sensitivity of the mixture. Getting back to the original question--if you are storing the chemicals unmixed until you are ready to use them it would not be a problem. Once it is mixed you have a "tiger in your tank". LOL.

[displayfireworks1]

Here is one of my videos from 2009. If you transport any of this MIXED IN FINAL outside of your own property , you are going to need an ATF license
.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyuypsMq-Kw&t=4s

[hypothesis]

thanks for sharing that video! Looks good i think mine has a bit more of a flash even in the daylight. If there is a safer recipe than mine that still gives a good report with a 22lr... I'm all ears.

[Kenny East]

I usually add 3-5% potassium perchlorate by weight to regular binary target mix... Still would not store it, draws moisture... I use cci stingers, not sure if it would work with a slower load.