Cobra 18R2

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Okay... I'm at the cliff's edge (so to speak) and I need someone to give me a nudge. Right now I have an 18R2 and three 18M's in a shopping cart and I'm looking at a $1500 bill.

I'm trying to get my brain wrapped around the expense vs. the benefits of shelling out that much money, when you only get 18 cues per module. So I'm hoping someone (or many of you) can tell me what I'm missing.

This year in my show I had (excluding mortars) six 2' x 8' boards that had 97 individual cakes. Obviously, to shoot each of those individually with a Cobra system I would need six 18M's. Twice as many as I'm looking at getting now. Next year I plan on adding 50% more cakes so now we're up to ~ 150 cakes. The good news is, I plan to split the show into a stage left and right, and have two things going up at the same time. Even then, if I run parallel circuits I'm still going to be 21 cues short.

I've got to believe I'm missing something. In my mind, it doesn't look like a Cobra is right for someone who only throws up 1 or 2 cakes at a time. It's more appropriate for someone who throws up maybe 4 at a time. Yes? No? I could probably get away with that (shooting 2 at a time on each side) but then my show would shrink down to about 10-15 min. from the 40 it was this year. Maybe that's the answer.

I'm just trying to get some input from the people who use it and see if my expectations are too high, too low, or there's something I'm just not considering. Maybe there's a different way to wire it or shoot it or divide up the cues that I'm not considering.

Any thoughts/tips/tricks/suggestions would be welcome and appreciated!! If you would prefer to PM me, that works too.

[Bazerk]

Rick, let me tell you from experience, that you will be extremely happy with your Cobra purchase my friend. It changes everything! You can start with doing part of the show like you used to and using the mods to do the rest or vice versa. I am adding a module every year. The thing you want to keep in ind is that more fireworks should mean more happiness in the air within a given time. I wouldn't keep extending the duration of the show. Anything over 20 mins gets monotonous to the viewers, no matter how much fun the pyro is having. I dont know if you watched my show but I did three firing locations at 20 mins using 5 modules. You can use one cue to ignite fuse that is strung together between cakes if you want. Quick match is great for using 1 cue to send up multiple cakes at once. I used 1 que and quick match for the first 5 mins of my show. I was launching 6 200g cakes at a time that way. Take a look at my video. In closing, I will tell you that your next step in upping your game will be a firing system moreso than adding more product. Quality begins to tip the scales over quantity after you've hit the 20 minute mark bud.


https://youtu.be/UyU1D60HTZ0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UyU1D60HTZ0&feature=youtu.be

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Rick, let me tell you from experience, that you will be extremely happy with your Cobra purchase my friend. It changes everything! You can start with doing part of the show like you used to and using the mods to do the rest or vice versa. I am adding a module every year. The thing you want to keep in ind is that more fireworks should mean more happiness in the air within a given time. I wouldn't keep extending the duration of the show. Anything over 20 mins gets monotonous to the viewers, no matter how much fun the pyro is having. I dont know if you watched my show but I did three firing locations at 20 mins using 5 modules. You can use one cue to ignite fuse that is strung together between cakes if you want. Quick match is great for using 1 cue to send up multiple cakes at once. I used 1 que and quick match for the first 5 mins of my show. I was launching 6 200g cakes at a time that way. Take a look at my video. In closing, I will tell you that your next step in upping your game will be a firing system moreso than adding more product. Quality begins to tip the scales over quantity after you've hit the 20 minute mark bud.


https://youtu.be/UyU1D60HTZ0

No argument from me my FFP (Fellow Florida Pyro!) I'm definitely not looking to extend the show time, and I'm definitely looking to get more stuff up in the air at the same time. Hence the stage left and right idea, and with 50% more products. You did give me a great idea. I loved your video and as I recall, you said you used a lot of 200G cakes in your finale if I'm not mistaken. So I could wire two boards with 200G cakes and nothing but quick fuse (I don't have a 54 so I can't get the quick match) for the pre-finale. That would only require 2 cues total for those 2 boards.

I'm soooo ready to get away from the single fuse thing and trying to get the timing right on a single 8' long board. I want to squib it, wire it, script it, and then sit back and enjoy the show already.

Let me ask you this... Do you wire your cakes in series or parallel? I've had many people tell me to stay away from series because if one fails they all fail. Then others tell me 'I've been doing it for years in series and never had a problem!" With my luck, using a flame thrower would be a problem! However, if I ran a third stage and ran things in series, I might be able to get away with just 2 firing modules and still get more stuff in the air for a lower entrance cost on the Cobra line. That might make the difference right there. But if I wire it wrong and/or it fails to fire.... Ugggg....

Decisions decisions.....

I do appreciate the help my friend!! Please keep those ideas coming!!

[Bazerk]

I do it in parallel so that if one fails, it doesnt effect the other. I think the series may become an issue if you spread the distances too far due to resistance and whatnot. I have not tested this theory though. The first 5 mins of my show was pretty much 200g cakes. I did have 12 during the show in there as well. Three modules is a great number so that you can use 2 modules and set them to the same channel and put up duplicate cakes at the same time. I use the third module to send up stuff between them. Whatever you decide to do, you will definitely see what the hype is all about. I underestimated the value of a firing system for the last 4 years and now I wonder how I ever managed without one. I am up to 5 modules now and each time I add another one, I come up with a way to add it to my show for a different effect. Keep in mind also, that if you get your 54, you may start to switch over to racks and shells and add a few cakes to that instead of the opposite, like we are doing now. I know that I will be building more racks each year and start to minimize the number of cakes I am using during my show. Better effects, less mess and much easier setups are what I am looking forward to.

[maltpj]

Bazerk,
WOW!! Nice show! Mixing in the 1.3 sure kicks it up a notch! Makes me want to get my 54.

Do you have a pictures of your pre fired set-up?

[maltpj]

Rick,
I purchased an 18R2 and 5-18m's and although it really hurt the back pocket, I have no buyers remorse. I too like Bazerk plan to buy 1 or 2 more firing modules each year till I have enough to shoot a show to music.

My first shoot with the Cobra went great, all went as planned and I actually got to watch the show with everyone. Plus you put space between you and the fireworks, should something go wrong.

So... BIG NUDGE!!....you won't be sorry!

Be safe
Phil

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Keep in mind also, that if you get your 54, you may start to switch over to racks and shells and add a few cakes to that instead of the opposite, like we are doing now. I know that I will be building more racks each year and start to minimize the number of cakes I am using during my show.

This year I added a 36 shot fan style mortar rack to the four 25 shot milk crates racks I've been using. Next year I plan to have an additional twelve 25 shot milk crate racks and one 50 shot fanned mortar rack. So with any luck next year I'll be throwing up 3 times as many mortars as this year. I have a cheap 12 cue electric firing system I bought for this years show that I planned on using to set off the mortar racks from a stage left and right position, moving in towards the center from both sides. That's where the 36 and 50 shot racks will fire back out towards the left and right where I hope to punctuate the festivities with two cremora fireball pots. That's the plan anyway. As we used to say in the military you gotta have a plan. It gives you something to deviate from later. :rolleyes:

All of this is another reason I need a good solid remote firing system. You can't do all of that reliably and synchronized using visco. At least I can't.

As for the distance issue.. My recollection is if you wire in series you need LESS juice to fire the effect(s), not more. I'll have to double check that. But the main deterrent is that if one fails, they all fail. Again, I understand the concept (if one fails they all fail) but the Cobra allows you to check the continuity through the remote. So as long as the continuity is there at showtime, I guess I don't understand why it would fail to fire during the show and therefore be less reliable. Again.... Maybe I'm just missing something...

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Rick,
I purchased an 18R2 and 5-18m's and although it really hurt the back pocket, I have no buyers remorse. I too like Bazerk plan to buy 1 or 2 more firing modules each year till I have enough to shoot a show to music.

My first shoot with the Cobra went great, all went as planned and I actually got to watch the show with everyone. Plus you put space between you and the fireworks, should something go wrong.

So... BIG NUDGE!!....you won't be sorry!

Be safe
Phil

Hey there Phil! another FFP!! Thanks for the input. Let me ask you... How do you set up your show? Do you use multiple stages (left, center, right) or everything in a single row, etc. Do you have multiple cakes wired through the same remote? Or do you just use the same channel on a different remote? Do you wire in parallel or series or maybe both? How many cakes were you able to wire together with those remotes? I'd be curious to see any setup picks of your show if you have any to share. Bazerk did a fabulous job with his show! I can see why people love this system. Did you find the learning curve fairly shallow with this system? Or was it more difficult than you expected?

An 18R2 with 5 remotes would crush my fireworks budget. Not to mention my wife would crush my skull if she knew what that cost! So if I pull the trigger on this and pick up a Cobra, I'm going to have to ease into it. I do appreciate the nudge though! Lol...

[maltpj]

Rick,
Where are you getting mortar tubes?

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Rick,
Where are you getting mortar tubes?

I bought them from Pyroboom. That's where I picked up the 36 shot fan rack last year too. They're one of Dave's sponsors.

[maltpj]

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=1319&stc=1http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=1320&stc=1
Hey there Phil! another FFP!! Thanks for the input. Let me ask you... How do you set up your show? Do you use multiple stages (left, center, right) or everything in a single row, etc. Do you have multiple cakes wired through the same remote? Or do you just use the same channel on a different remote? Do you wire in parallel or series or maybe both? How many cakes were you able to wire together with those remotes? I'd be curious to see any setup picks of your show if you have any to share. Bazerk did a fabulous job with his show! I can see why people love this system. Did you find the learning curve fairly shallow with this system? Or was it more difficult than you expected?


An 18R2 with 5 remotes would crush my fireworks budget. Not to mention my wife would crush my skull if she knew what that cost! So if I pull the trigger on this and pick up a Cobra, I'm going to have to ease into it. I do appreciate the nudge though! Lol...


This year I built a bunch of mortars and racks and purchased a Cobra system.

In the back of the display bunched my mortars in fans of 30 (3 x 10) and fused 6 mortars together so each fan had 5 cues on each bunch. (see pictures)
I also had a bunch of 150 fused together for the finale.
In the front I had 72 cakes, and I wired them where two fired at the same time, one on the right and one on the left and while they were burning I would cue in some mortars. It worked out OK for my first remote shoot.

[maltpj]

I bought them from Pyroboom. That's where I picked up the 36 shot fan rack last year too. They're one of Dave's sponsors.

You know you can save a lot of money if you build them yourself.

They sell HDPE pipe right in your backyard in Mulberry, Fl. That's where I purchased my pipe when I built mine.

http://www.hdpeinc.com/ --------- Not sure if this is OK with Dave?

[Bazerk]

Bazerk,
WOW!! Nice show! Mixing in the 1.3 sure kicks it up a notch! Makes me want to get my 54.

Do you have a pictures of your pre fired set-up?

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/showthread.php?4915-My-first-show-using-1-3&highlight=Bazerk

I didnt do a good job of documenting my setup and for that I apologize. Most of this was last minute and all I could think about was getting everything done in time. I started and finished my boards on July 2 and finished them on July 3, lol.

[JmFnG]

You know you can save a lot of money if you build them yourself.

They sell HDPE pipe right in your backyard in Mulberry, Fl. That's where I purchased my pipe when I built mine.

http://www.hdpeinc.com/ --------- Not sure if this is OK with Dave?

Thanks a BUNCH for that link. Just spoke with Tyler and really like their pricing. Looks like more racks in my future!

[djsmurf]

Okay... I'm at the cliff's edge (so to speak) and I need someone to give me a nudge. Right now I have an 18R2 and three 18M's in a shopping cart and I'm looking at a $1500 bill.

I'm trying to get my brain wrapped around the expense vs. the benefits of shelling out that much money, when you only get 18 cues per module. So I'm hoping someone (or many of you) can tell me what I'm missing.

This year in my show I had (excluding mortars) six 2' x 8' boards that had 97 individual cakes. Obviously, to shoot each of those individually with a Cobra system I would need six 18M's. Twice as many as I'm looking at getting now. Next year I plan on adding 50% more cakes so now we're up to ~ 150 cakes. The good news is, I plan to split the show into a stage left and right, and have two things going up at the same time. Even then, if I run parallel circuits I'm still going to be 21 cues short.

I've got to believe I'm missing something. In my mind, it doesn't look like a Cobra is right for someone who only throws up 1 or 2 cakes at a time. It's more appropriate for someone who throws up maybe 4 at a time. Yes? No? I could probably get away with that (shooting 2 at a time on each side) but then my show would shrink down to about 10-15 min. from the 40 it was this year. Maybe that's the answer.

I'm just trying to get some input from the people who use it and see if my expectations are too high, too low, or there's something I'm just not considering. Maybe there's a different way to wire it or shoot it or divide up the cues that I'm not considering.

Any thoughts/tips/tricks/suggestions would be welcome and appreciated!! If you would prefer to PM me, that works too.

I guess the best question for you would be what are you looking at as alternatives? You can expand on the cobra system in the future. If you thinking about using 2 positions I think the cobra is still the best option. I have never ran a single fuse show so I don't know your pain there however could you single fuse part of each station and use the cobras to finish everything off? Expandability and support from the cobra team was was sold me on getting them. I'll shoot you a PM as well.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

I guess the best question for you would be what are you looking at as alternatives? You can expand on the cobra system in the future. If you thinking about using 2 positions I think the cobra is still the best option. I have never ran a single fuse show so I don't know your pain there however could you single fuse part of each station and use the cobras to finish everything off? Expandability and support from the cobra team was was sold me on getting them. I'll shoot you a PM as well.

I've looked at all the brands from Dave's sponsors, and a few that were suggested that I can't mention (because they're not Dave's sponsors) and I love the Cobra for it's versatility and programmability. I'd love to graduate to where I can do pyro musicals one day. It's the 18 cue thing that just has me stumped. I'm trying to get my brain wrapped around how it makes financial sense to spend $300 to fire 18 cakes. The obvious answer I come up with is, it doesn't. So I'm trying to figure out the tipping point to where it does make sense. That's where I'm trying to get input from you folks. I have no idea how many cakes people fire that use this system or how you have your shows designed. All I can do is *assume* that you folks are shooting 2, 3, or more cakes at the same time from various firing positions on each cue. In my mind, that seems to be the only way to justify the expense. And if that's the case, I'm wondering how you have your show layout set up. Other than the cheap Chinese remote system I used this year to light my single fuse boards, I've never shot a completely wireless/electronic show before. So before I drop $1500 or more on a Cobra or any other system, I need to make sure I have some clue as to how to best utilize the thing once it shows up in the mail.

Hope that makes sense.

Right now my big brain storm idea is to have a left and right stage and shoot at least two cakes at a time, one from each side. In order to maximize the cues, I'd have to place the 18M's in the center of the boards, and run two sets of wire out from each cue (one to the left, and one to the right) out to each cake. That would allow me to shoot 72 cakes using two 18M's. So if I bought four 18M's, I could shoot 144 cakes.

Is this number close to what the rest of you are shooting? Should I be considering a different show layout and/or a different wiring design? (i.e. Shooting in serial maybe?) Bazerk gave me a great idea when he said I can use my old system and a single fuse setup for part of the show, and he's right. I planned on incorporating more 200G cakes for the finale and the old system and a single fuse would work well there. I don't know. Like I said... Just looking for the best way to maximize the potential investment.

[djsmurf]

I've looked at all the brands from Dave's sponsors, and a few that were suggested that I can't mention (because they're not Dave's sponsors) and I love the Cobra for it's versatility and programmability. I'd love to graduate to where I can do pyro musicals one day. It's the 18 cue thing that just has me stumped. I'm trying to get my brain wrapped around how it makes financial sense to spend $300 to fire 18 cakes. The obvious answer I come up with is, it doesn't. So I'm trying to figure out the tipping point to where it does make sense. That's where I'm trying to get input from you folks. I have no idea how many cakes people fire that use this system or how you have your shows designed. All I can do is *assume* that you folks are shooting 2, 3, or more cakes at the same time from various firing positions on each cue. In my mind, that seems to be the only way to justify the expense. And if that's the case, I'm wondering how you have your show layout set up. Other than the cheap Chinese remote system I used this year to light my single fuse boards, I've never shot a completely wireless/electronic show before. So before I drop $1500 or more on a Cobra or any other system, I need to make sure I have some clue as to how to best utilize the thing once it shows up in the mail.

Hope that makes sense.

Right now my big brain storm idea is to have a left and right stage and shoot at least two cakes at a time, one from each side. In order to maximize the cues, I'd have to place the 18M's in the center of the boards, and run two sets of wire out from each cue (one to the left, and one to the right) out to each cake. That would allow me to shoot 72 cakes using two 18M's. So if I bought four 18M's, I could shoot 144 cakes.

Is this number close to what the rest of you are shooting? Should I be considering a different show layout and/or a different wiring design? (i.e. Shooting in serial maybe?) Bazerk gave me a great idea when he said I can use my old system and a single fuse setup for part of the show, and he's right. I planned on incorporating more 200G cakes for the finale and the old system and a single fuse would work well there. I don't know. Like I said... Just looking for the best way to maximize the potential investment.

Your 4 18m idea sounds perfect, scab wire is not terribly expensive. How far apart would your 2 stations be? Repurposing the old system is not a bad idea. Also have you looked at the 18s Slats?

[aftigz02]

I've been reading over the forum trying to catch up and I saw this thread (been overseas) and your asking questions I had with the Cobra system when I first purchased three years ago. I don't know if your still looking for a system or not, but I can provide you with my experience in wiring multiple cakes per cue on the Cobra.

The cobra is great if you know what stations you want to do and are willing to put in the time to wire up the cues. I started with a left and right station my first year. Left, middle, right on my second year. And did a 3 front station with a back 5 station this year. Yes, the 18 cues can be a pain if you want to put a lot of fireworks in the sky at the same time with out doing any visco fusing. The connectors on the module become real finicky when your trying to put 4 talons on one cue. I even went with 8 talons per cue this year on a couple of the earlier parts of the show. (LiPo batteries in the modules and talons in parallel) I strongly recommend you not do that however as it becomes real annoying to strip the wires on the talon then thread multiple talons together, bend the wires back on themselves and then put them in the module the day of the shoot. I think me and 2 others spent 8 hours pretty much straight doing just that for the show this year. (~420 talons total in the show) I find it takes about 3-5 minutes once you get good at it for two people working in tandem, one stripping and splitting the ends of the talons and one combining the talons together then putting masking tape on it and marking what cue and module it goes on it with a sharpie. So just allow yourself around 1.5 hours for your 72 cake show you mentioned for your first time for just wiring and marking if you end up going that route.

I don't really like the slat option because it just adds more cost with only marginal improvements for ability to spread a show out. I used scab wire this year and it is an option, but I can also say it becomes a bit of a headache as well trying to run wire the day of the show without getting everything tangled up. I ended up pre-cutting all the scab wire and then putting it in plastic bags with the module and cue number sharpied on the bag to help with this situation.

All and all, with just two modules doing four wires per cue you get 72 shots total as you mentioned. I don't know what length your going for and what size of the show, but seeing as you had a 40 minute show last year it may seem kind of small to you to only have 72 shots? I guess in comparison my 5 modules on the back show were shot in 7 minutes total. The front ones were around 6 minutes I think. Your idea for using the two modules in the middle with the scab wire going to each station is a good one. I would do some testing on how much you could stretch the distance though with the scab wire and how many talons you could put on the end of the scab wires. I tried to get Scott to give me a firm answer on how many feet of wire I could do with the new LiPo batteries with talons on the end, but I didn't really get a firm answer. I don't think he has done the testing and didn't want to give me a bad answer. As far as series or parrallel goes, from my experience I wouldn't recommend doing series if your doing a lot of talons on the same cue. The talons take some time (well ms) to heat up and if the filament in the first one breaks before the last one in the series is done heating up you may lose a couple on the strand. I tested this with talons and visco fuse. Your results may very though, just recommend testing it before you have a lot of black sky accidentally.

Hopefully this helps you a little bit and if you need clarification on anything or have more questions just ask. I have always been running around the max recommend talons per cue each year so I have a bit of knowledge I can pass on to make your first time a little easier if end up going with four cues per module. Anyways hope you enjoy whatever system you end up getting!

[South Carolina Mike]

I did it! Starting to bring it together!
18R2 and an 18M on the way! 80 Talon igniter clips, 200' of Visco, 200 firework junction fuse connectors and 100 DR11 mortar tubes will be here next week. I'll build racks in the coming weeks and I'll never hand fire again!
I feel like a huge weight has been lifted off of my shoulders! Can't wait to bring it all together for the 4th of July!
(can you tell I'm excited?) :)

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Congrats Mike!! Can't wait to see it in action. Please post some setup pics/video for us!

[Rick_In_Tampa]

I've been reading over the forum trying to catch up and I saw this thread (been overseas) and your asking questions I had with the Cobra system when I first purchased three years ago. I don't know if your still looking for a system or not, but I can provide you with my experience in wiring multiple cakes per cue on the Cobra.

aftigz02 - My apologies!! No idea how I missed this response way back in Sept. Thanks so much for the info. This year I've decided to up the anti and I'm using firewire initiators in addition to some talons. Uncle Sam owes me some $$ and if the check comes through soon, I'll be picking up some Cobra gear for the 4th!!

[South Carolina Mike]

Rick,
I certainly will!

[Rick_In_Tampa]

I did it! Starting to bring it together!
18R2 and an 18M on the way! 80 Talon igniter clips, 200' of Visco, 200 firework junction fuse connectors and 100 DR11 mortar tubes will be here next week. I'll build racks in the coming weeks and I'll never hand fire again!
I feel like a huge weight has been lifted off of my shoulders! Can't wait to bring it all together for the 4th of July!
(can you tell I'm excited?) :)

Okay.... I am soooo tired of being shamed here! So I went and did it. Just pulled the trigger on an 18R2 and 4 mods!! Between my local pyro buddy and you good people, I just couldn't take it any longer.

All I can say is, since this is all technically your collective fault, :rolleyes: I hope one of you will let me crash at your place when my wife finds out! Lol...

[carrant]

@Rick_In_Tampa

Congrats on your COBRA purchase!

[Rick_In_Tampa]

@Rick_In_Tampa

Congrats on your COBRA purchase!

Thank you Sir!! Trying to catch up to you big time shooters. I can't wait to get it in my hot little hands. Already working on Show Creator and building a script for my July 4th show. Neat stuff!!

Speaking of which... Let me ask you guys something since I'm thinking about it.

When you're building the script you enter a fire time for each cue based on the burn time of the cake. It seems to me that if I set cue 1 to fire at 1:00 (for example) and if the cake on that cue is programmed to burn for 30 seconds, when I go to program cue #2, the default fire time should automatically be set at 1:30. Obviously, you want to be able to edit it if you want overlap or black sky for whatever reason, but the basic information to calculate the time one cake ends and the next cake fires is already built into the spreadsheet used to build the database that you use to build the cues.

I hope that makes sense. I just don't see why you would need to do manual calculations on that type of thing. Seems to me that basic functionality would already be built into the software. Maybe it is and I'm just not aware of how to enable it.

Does that make sense?

[South Carolina Mike]

Okay.... I am soooo tired of being shamed here! So I went and did it. Just pulled the trigger on an 18R2 and 4 mods!! Between my local pyro buddy and you good people, I just couldn't take it any longer.

All I can say is, since this is all technically your collective fault, :rolleyes: I hope one of you will let me crash at your place when my wife finds out! Lol...

Rick,
Awesome! We can learn together about the scripting, this is all new to me!
You are always welcome to crash here once your wife finds out, (4 mods? OMG, yes she's doing to kill you and why 4? Planning on firing 100K worth of fireworks?}
My girlfriend found this at the front door today and said COOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Looky what came today!
http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=1833&stc=1

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Rick,
Awesome! We can learn together about the scripting, this is all new to me!
You are always welcome to crash here once your wife finds out, (4 mods? OMG, yes she's doing to kill you and why 4? Planning on firing 100K worth of fireworks?}
My girlfriend found this at the front door today and said COOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Looky what came today!

Lol... Thanks for the offer! It looks great!! Can't wait to get mine. Did you get the Show Creator software? I've been playing with it the past few days. Very cool! Took a bit to load up all the data on the cakes including the links to the You Tube videos, but once I got that all together and imported, it really works well. Today I built out all 18 cues for the first two mods. If you didn't buy it you should at least try the demo version. I think you'll like it.

No... I don't have $100K worth of fireworks. (I wish I did!!) But I do have a little over 200 cakes on the way. I have 124 of the 500G variety that I plan to shoot with the Cobra system. So even with 4 mods I'm going to have to double up on each cue to fire them all.

So when do you plan on breaking that thing in?? :cool:

[carrant]

When you're building the script you enter a fire time for each cue based on the burn time of the cake. It seems to me that if I set cue 1 to fire at 1:00 (for example) and if the cake on that cue is programmed to burn for 30 seconds, when I go to program cue #2, the default fire time should automatically be set at 1:30. Obviously, you want to be able to edit it if you want overlap or black sky for whatever reason, but the basic information to calculate the time one cake ends and the next cake fires is already built into the spreadsheet used to build the database that you use to build the cues.

I hope that makes sense. I just don't see why you would need to do manual calculations on that type of thing. Seems to me that basic functionality would already be built into the software. Maybe it is and I'm just not aware of how to enable it.

Does that make sense?

I didn't order the Show Creator software because I run Ubuntu and OSX at home (WIN32 free!). So I don't have any experience with it!

However you might consider that the time to fire is (or might be?) adjusted based on the flight time (for a mortar) or the fuse delay (for a cake).

For instance if Cue 1 fires at 1:00 and will burn for 30s
Cue 2 is set to fire at 1:30 but the time of flight (or fuse time) is 2s then the cue will fire at 1:28 so the BOOM happens at 1:30.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

I didn't order the Show Creator software because I run Ubuntu and OSX at home (WIN32 free!). So I don't have any experience with it!

However you might consider that the time to fire is (or might be?) adjusted based on the flight time (for a mortar) or the fuse delay (for a cake).

For instance if Cue 1 fires at 1:00 and will burn for 30s
Cue 2 is set to fire at 1:30 but the time of flight (or fuse time) is 2s then the cue will fire at 1:28 so the BOOM happens at 1:30.

I tried Ubuntu a few times and never figured it out completely so I gave up. I have 0 patience which didn't help. Anyway...

I see what you're saying with the shoot times relative to the lift times. Part of what I love about the program so far is that you can tweak those things. I did find the radio button that allows you to set the next cue to fire based on the burn time of the previous cake. Again though, I just would have thought the program would set the default fire time for the next cake based on the burn time of the previous cake, and allow you to tweak from there. No biggie.

[Bazerk]

I tried Ubuntu a few times and never figured it out completely so I gave up. I have 0 patience which didn't help. Anyway...

I see what you're saying with the shoot times relative to the lift times. Part of what I love about the program so far is that you can tweak those things. I did find the radio button that allows you to set the next cue to fire based on the burn time of the previous cake. Again though, I just would have thought the program would set the default fire time for the next cake based on the burn time of the previous cake, and allow you to tweak from there. No biggie.

The show creator software automatically sets the next item to start at the end of the one just before it. You can then tweak it from there. For example, I start my next cake 2 seconds before the previous one ends. I can send you one of my scripts rick if you want to see a completed one.

[displayfireworks1]

Not sure if you saw my video showing some of the Cobra Show Creator using Titanium Salutes. If you get this video and make it larger you can see how some of the software operates. I guess if you are using Consumer Fireworks you need to know the product timing. And Consumer fireworks are notorious for not always performing the same consistently.
.
.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rKxnbTEOmLY

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Dave - Thanks for posting that video. Great explanation of the versatility of the programming. I've only been playing with the demo version for 2 days now. If you wouldn't mind providing some feedback, I'd appreciate it.

I only have 4 mods and I have 124 cakes to fire. So I need to fire 2 cakes on every cue. I'm going to try and do a left and right stage this year, and I have 5M firewire initiators.

So essentially every cue is going to be wired in parallel to fire one cake from each side at a time. I hope that make sense.

Here's a shot of how I *think* I need to program that.
.
http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=1841&stc=1

Based on wiring in parallel, each line obviously represents firing 2 cakes at a time. One on the left and one on the right.

If there's a better, smarter, easier way to do what I'm describing, please let me know!! I have visions of scab wire running all over the place right now and it concerns me to say the least.

[maltpj]

Rick,
Congrats for pulling the trigger on the Cobra equipment. You just opened the door to a whole new world in firework fun!

This is an expensive hobby so I try to cut corners where ever I can and get the most bang for my buck.

I just wanted to chime in on the program / software subject.

First, if your not doing a musical, you can script your show using excel and it's not hard at all. If you look on the Cobra site, there' s a youtube video link that shows you how. There's even a free downloadable example script. (excel cvs file)

I too have tried the Cobra Show Creator and love it, but for $59 for a two year license I won't purchase it. I understand the work and time involved to develop the software and I understand Scott has to eat too but most all of his competitors give you a programing software package free with the purchase of their equipment. I would concider purchasing Cobra Show Creator for $59 if it came with a lifetime license.

There's shareware software called PYROTHEK which will do everything that Show Creator does and it's free! If you like it and use it you can show your appreciation with a donation but it not required. http://cobra.pyrothek.com/

There's another software package called **** *** Backyard Edition which cost $89 for a lifetime license. This software is very cool because you can see/watch the show/pyro musical that your creating as you go. This package will create a script that will work with your Cobra 18R2 when your done creating it.
I purchased this software and love it. I'm working on a pyro musical now I plan to shoot this 4th. Here's a link to what I got so far so you can get an idea what it can do: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDxFgUmr2W8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDxFgUmr2W8
Good Luck!
FFP Phil

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Phil - Thanks!! I'm very excited to use the new system. You're not joking about this being an expensive hobby! Less than 5 years ago my entire pyro budget was less than $500. This year already I'm just under ten times that amount. The good news is the Cobra system was a good chunk of that. So next year I can buy a few more mods and still spend less money than this year.

I really appreciate the tips on the software. Since I was making a major investment this year in the Cobra, I figured what the heck. I'll spring for the software just to see how it works. $30 a year relative to what I spent is nothing. Having said that, if I can get the same functionality for free, I'm all for that. I can afford free all year long!

The end state for me is doing pyro musicals. This year, I'm just going to be tickled pink if I can get everything to fire correctly without having to use a cigarette lighter! I'll consider that a huge win. Next year I hope to start putting everything to music. Baby steps.

I can't get to You Tube from work, but I'll definitely check out your vid when I get home!

[displayfireworks1]

Last I heard Cobra is aware of that Shareware program and has no objection to it.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Phil - Just checked out the video. That's slick as snot! How do you get all the animation for the various cakes? If you have to build it yourself I'm toast.

[maltpj]

Phil - Just checked out the video. That's slick as snot! How do you get all the animation for the various cakes? If you have to build it yourself I'm toast.

There's a bunch of different brand cakes, mines included in the package. Plus you can import new ones and share them with other users. You can also create your own.

[maltpj]

Another cool thing you can do with this package is, you can take a picture of you shoot site and import it in and use it as a back round for you simulation.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Another cool thing you can do with this package is, you can take a picture of you shoot site and import it in and use it as a back round for you simulation.

That's cool. I'm going to have to test drive this one. I spent the better part of the day today completing the script in Show Creator for my July 4th show. I like the program, but I'm not real keen on how the "timed show" events calculate (or rather don't calculate!) the times. Too much manual calculating and rearranging of the cue lines required. It can really screw up your lineup if you're not careful. No drag and drop function to realign things either.

Hopefully the program you posted is a little user friendly in that regard.

[esgrillo]

Rick, the more mods you get, the less scab you use. It really is inversely proportional. I use a lot of fuse to link multiple cakes together as a unit to maximize my cues and minmize scab. You can see that at he beginning of my videos. For example I have 90 200g cakes as on 3 separate platforms as part of my finale that only use 3 cues and no scab.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Rick, the more mods you get, the less scab you use. It really is inversely proportional. I use a lot of fuse to link multiple cakes together as a unit to maximize my cues and minmize scab. You can see that at he beginning of my videos. For example I have 90 200g cakes as on 3 separate platforms as part of my finale that only use 3 cues and no scab.

I figured that out quick Ed! This morning I just finished building my show in MS Visio. I'm doing away with the boards this year and I'm going to stake and tape the cakes together. So I have 6 sets of 3 cakes per side. 2 cakes per cue. (18 on the left, 18 on the right.) Because I can only buy 3M initiators; and because I only have 4 mods that need to sit in between the 2 sides; I either have to use scab wire to separate the two sides, or I'm only going to be able to separate the cakes by a max of 20". Right now it looks close on paper, but since I'm a one man operation, I'm inclined to say it's good enough. I don't know. I'm toying with the idea of cutting and prepping 124 five foot scab wire extensions to add to each initiator to give me 30' of separation. Just not sure the effort is going to make an appreciable difference in the look of the show. I'd be interested in hearing your opinion on that.

It's funny you should mention the 200G cakes and your finale... This year I'm opening the show with 94 - 200G cakes and 24 red strobes divided between 2 boards (1 left, 1 right). These 2 boards are the only boards in the show, and all the cakes will be visco'd together. Last year I started with 24 - 200G cakes and the thing drug on.. I was pissed. So now I think I may have over-done it a tad. Lol.... Oh well.

[South Carolina Mike]

Pretty!
My new Cobra system is here!

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Very nice Mike!!

[esgrillo]

5.0 upgrade is a must. The improvement on signal strength with MESH is really noticeable when I did a field test a couple days ago. Had 61 signal strength on a 18m about 800-900 ft away. I had another 18m positioned between the far 18m and the 18r2 so the MESH technology was working.

[Pyro47240]

[QUOTE= I only have 4 mods and I have 124 cakes to fire. So I need to fire 2 cakes on every cue. I'm going to try and do a left and right stage this year, and I have 5M firewire initiators.

[/QUOTE]

Rick, Don't wire in parallel. In parallel you run the risk of not knowing if one of the multiple item's does not have continuity. Wire in series and you'll know if everything is good or not. Made that mistake my first year with Cobra. Now I wire everything in series just to be sure and it works nicely!


18R2
13 18M's
Audio box
Adding control panel this year!

[Pyro47240]

I figured that out quick Ed! This morning I just finished building my show in MS Visio. I'm doing away with the boards this year and I'm going to stake and tape the cakes together. So I have 6 sets of 3 cakes per side. 2 cakes per cue. (18 on the left, 18 on the right.) Because I can only buy 3M initiators; and because I only have 4 mods that need to sit in between the 2 sides; I either have to use scab wire to separate the two sides, or I'm only going to be able to separate the cakes by a max of 20". Right now it looks close on paper, but since I'm a one man operation, I'm inclined to say it's good enough. I don't know. I'm toying with the idea of cutting and prepping 124 five foot scab wire extensions to add to each initiator to give me 30' of separation. Just not sure the effort is going to make an appreciable difference in the look of the show. I'd be interested in hearing your opinion on that.

It's funny you should mention the 200G cakes and your finale... This year I'm opening the show with 94 - 200G cakes and 24 red strobes divided between 2 boards (1 left, 1 right). These 2 boards are the only boards in the show, and all the cakes will be visco'd together. Last year I started with 24 - 200G cakes and the thing drug on.. I was pissed. So now I think I may have over-done it a tad. Lol.... Oh well.

10 extra feet is not going to make a big difference! I shoot 5 positions across 250 feet and each station is 50' apart and the breaks are still pretty close.

Last year it was 10 modules, 2 at each position. like this.


Mod1 <---50'---> Mod2 <---50'---> Mod3 <---50'---> Mod4 <---50'---> Mod5


Mod6 <---50'---> Mod7 <---50' ---> Mod8 <---50'---> Mod9 <---50'--->Mod10

For you a very easy way to get more spread on your cakes would be actually using boards and creating boards that are angled towards the left and towards the right. No scab wire needed. A 25° angle will give you much more spread than 30' between breaks. Problem solved! Just make sure you glue your cakes down. I use hot glue and it works fine!

[esgrillo]

Pryo, for clarification, you are referencing firewire initiators or ematch only on your series vs. parallel comment and not talon, right??

btw, I added control panel and running in test mode.... very cool... I think I am going to have to take the plunge

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Rick, Don't wire in parallel. In parallel you run the risk of not knowing if one of the multiple item's does not have continuity. Wire in series and you'll know if everything is good or not. Made that mistake my first year with Cobra. Now I wire everything in series just to be sure and it works nicely!


18R2
13 18M's
Audio box
Adding control panel this year!

Interesting. I didn't think this was a big concern. Actually, I was of the understanding that wiring in series is the least reliable method when compared to parallel. What was the experience you had the first year? Did you have long runs of scab wire? Did you use something other than 22awg wire? What power/battery setup did you use? Just curious why you're recommending something that's contrary to everything I've heard and read about wiring.

Does anyone else share this opinion? I'd be interested in hearing what the rest of you have experienced.

I'm an army of one. So I'd rather not get into any complex wiring the day of the show. I suppose I could wire it in serial right at the mod, but is the extra effort really warranted??

[Pyro47240]

Pryo, for clarification, you are referencing firewire initiators or ematch only on your series vs. parallel comment and not talon, right??

btw, I added control panel and running in test mode.... very cool... I think I am going to have to take the plunge
Yes, Ed is correct in that this will not work with talons and is only recommended for firewire initiators or e-match. Thanks for catching that Ed!

[Pyro47240]

Interesting. I didn't think this was a big concern. Actually, I was of the understanding that wiring in series is the least reliable method when compared to parallel. What was the experience you had the first year? Did you have long runs of scab wire? Did you use something other than 22awg wire? What power/battery setup did you use? Just curious why you're recommending something that's contrary to everything I've heard and read about wiring.

Does anyone else share this opinion? I'd be interested in hearing what the rest of you have experienced.

I'm an army of one. So I'd rather not get into any complex wiring the day of the show. I suppose I could wire it in serial right at the mod, but is the extra effort really warranted??

Yes, this was my first year and several years ago. Since then, I have wired in series and it has been very reliable and I know that the entire chain has continuity..I didn't have long runs of scab in parallel, but I had over 100ft runs in series without issues. In parallel, multiple wires are connected together and plugged into the system and it's possible to have one of the wires connection not so good. Although the system shows good because one of the two or three wires are showing good. In series all wires have to be connected for sure and there is no question about it if you have good continuity, you have a positive and a negative and the chain must be completed properly for it to work.

[Pyro47240]

You can see part of my last show here. There were some camera issues so it's incomplete. But you'll get the idea. Everything is in series!!!
https://youtu.be/MF--nizY22I Show starts around the 30 second mark!

[esgrillo]

Right on the continuity. I have used initiators in series too. Had 3 cues of 8 going off at the same time in my last show. It was a wide effect too, at least 200ft wide. Looked pretty good you can see it here: https://youtu.be/ULOS-ZfDCN4?t=266

[Rick_In_Tampa]

10 extra feet is not going to make a big difference! I shoot 5 positions across 250 feet and each station is 50' apart and the breaks are still pretty close.

Last year it was 10 modules, 2 at each position. like this.


Mod1 <---50'---> Mod2 <---50'---> Mod3 <---50'---> Mod4 <---50'---> Mod5


Mod6 <---50'---> Mod7 <---50' ---> Mod8 <---50'---> Mod9 <---50'--->Mod10

For you a very easy way to get more spread on your cakes would be actually using boards and creating boards that are angled towards the left and towards the right. No scab wire needed. A 25° angle will give you much more spread than 30' between breaks. Problem solved! Just make sure you glue your cakes down. I use hot glue and it works fine!

I use boards every year. This year though, the plan is to just tape them together and stake them down. I'm just not going to have the time or support to build the boards, configure the cake for initiators and then wire everything to the mods. So I'm going to try and just build the show in place the day of the 4th. That's the only way I can see making it happen.

The only 2 boards I plan on having will hold the 200G cakes and strobes that I plan on using to open the show. Those two boards will also be the only two where I use visco to wire everything together.

Not sure how well this will come through, but here's the tentative layout so far:

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=1909&stc=1

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Right on the continuity. I have used initiators in series too. Had 3 cues of 8 going off at the same time in my last show. It was a wide effect too, at least 200ft wide. Looked pretty good you can see it here: https://youtu.be/ULOS-ZfDCN4?t=266

Still can't get over that show Ed. If I'm following you here, you're talking about the effect at the 4:31 mark, yes? If so, can you elaborate a bit on what you used and how you wired it? When you say 3 cues of 8, I assume you mean we're seeing 24 (what looks to be) comets going up at the same time, yes?

[esgrillo]

Rick, yes you have that correct, 3 cues of 8. Each cue in series wired to a separate 18m. Meaning three 18m's were used. You can't fire something like this on a single 18m (especially if you are in talon mode) because it fires each circuit for 2 secs and if you try on 1 mod then it is like that mod firing all of them at the same time and it will not work (trust me on that, I had this effect fail more than once).

[esgrillo]

The are brocade mines from 76. MN206 http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=1912&stc=1

[Rick_In_Tampa]

The are brocade mines from 76. MN206 http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=1912&stc=1

Ah I see. I was looking at those. They looked difficult to deal with though, so I passed on them.

How did you set them up? i.e. Did you glue them down to boards? Did you make some sort of rack for them?

[Pyro47240]

Ed, I don't use initiators, I use normal 1.3 e-matches... I really liked that mine front... 200' is a good spread. I'm going to have to try this! What I'm really into trying right now is called a parabolic effect. Which is essentially this shape done with tiger tail comets set up at the correct angles.
http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=1913&stc=1

Rick, to answer your question, the 76 mines can be glued, wire tied, or even rack if the design was right.
I use these and I do put them in racks like you would mortar tubes.
http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=1914&stc=1

[Rick_In_Tampa]

A parabolic effect with tiger tails.... Now that I would love to see!! Sounds way beyond my level of expertise at the moment though.

How in the world do you set something like that up?

[esgrillo]

Rick, I keep it really simple. All I do is stick a small metal stake in the ground (they are actually ones for my tomato cages lol) and then I just use a little packing tape to attach the mine to the stake. I do it all in the field. The mines just sit directly on the ground. Fast and simple. I use the 10 ft firwire initators and when I split the wire to get them in series it provides 10 ft of gap between each one, no measuring needed.

[Pyro47240]

A parabolic effect with tiger tails.... Now that I would love to see!! Sounds way beyond my level of expertise at the moment though.

How in the world do you set something like that up?

OK it's geometry at it's best, but I'll do my best to explain. Let say you have a right side triangle. The ground bring the bottom and 90 degrees being the right side. Now apply this thought process to your fireworks setup. It's only a matter of determining the angles needed for each straight line. The straight lines, comets with tails make up that straight line.
That larger the spread the better the effect.
P.S. Ed, your lake front would be awesome for this effect!
I have drawn and example here for you.
1915

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Rick, I keep it really simple. All I do is stick a small metal stake in the ground (they are actually ones for my tomato cages lol) and then I just use a little packing tape to attach the mine to the stake.

Lol... OMG. Now that is a great idea!! I'm using strobes for the first time this year. I was concerned about gluing them down. I think I might just use your metal stake trick. That will also allow me to spread them out more. Cool!!

Man I love this site. So many cool ideas... :cool:

[Rick_In_Tampa]

OK it's geometry at it's best, but I'll do my best to explain. Let say you have a right side triangle. The ground bring the bottom and 90 degrees being the right side. Now apply this thought process to your fireworks setup. It's only a matter of determining the angles needed for each straight line. The straight lines, comets with tails make up that straight line.
That larger the spread the better the effect.
P.S. Ed, your lake front would be awesome for this effect!
I have drawn and example here for you.
1915

School wasn't my strong subject so bear with me here...

If I understand the concept correctly, this effect would fire from right to left (as you've drawn it) yes? I'm trying to get my brain wrapped around how this would look with comets. Have you done this before? Has anyone done this before? Seems to me you would need something more "linear" like roman candles or mines, no?

[esgrillo]

Lol... OMG. Now that is a great idea!! I'm using strobes for the first time this year. I was concerned about gluing them down. I think I might just use your metal stake trick. That will also allow me to spread them out more. Cool!!

Man I love this site. So many cool ideas... :cool:

Rick, strobes are real short and the bottoms are not made of paper not plastic like the mines so I put those on boards. I would be a bit hesitant about sitting them in the grass especially if you set things up in advance and have any risk of rain. Plus in my case I actually have to elevate them as well because the line of site drops about 6 ft in elevation from the audience view to my platforms so you would not see them if I did not raise them. I do the same for gerbs.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Rick, strobes are real short and the bottoms are not made of paper not plastic like the mines so I put those on boards. I would be a bit hesitant about sitting them in the grass especially if you set things up in advance and have any risk of rain. Plus in my case I actually have to elevate them as well because the line of site drops about 6 ft in elevation from the audience view to my platforms so you would not see them if I did not raise them. I do the same for gerbs.

Ed - I used some wooden stakes to elevate my remotes last year. You can see them on the right in this picture:

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=1917&stc=1

So my thought is to do the same thing with the strobes. Mount them to stakes or steel rods, elevated above the ground.

This would allow me to spread them out across the show front to create a bigger effect. If they come with e-match ports I can use some 1M initiators and space them out around the rest of the show.

I think that would be cool.

[esgrillo]

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=1919&stc=1.http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=1920&stc=1

That should work good! This is what I had to do....

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Those are some crazy platforms! lol... I'd be afraid they'd tip over and shoot at the crowd. How deep did you sink those things?

It looks like you used talons on the strobes, yes? So I'm assuming no e-match ports. I'm going to have to review your show vid to see how this effect looked.

How did those initiators work lighting the visco on those gerbs? Any failures there?

[Pyro47240]

School wasn't my strong subject so bear with me here...

If I understand the concept correctly, this effect would fire from right to left (as you've drawn it) yes? Yes, It's a sweep or you could do them at the same time. I'm trying to get my brain wrapped around how this would look with comets. Comets with tails. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5PqY16wgP0 (Check around the 7:40 mark) Have you done this before? Has anyone done this before? Seems to me you would need something more "linear" like roman candles or mines, no? Nope not really!

Enjoy and Thanks!

[esgrillo]

Rick, they are solid, about 1.5 - 2 ft in ground. Talons on the strobes. However they did not fire, I think I mentioned earlier making sure you use only version 8 talons and not version 7. I had a 100% fail on 2 cues of my strobes during my last 4th show. There were 5 on each cue, LiPo module. All was wired good. Contacted Cobra and they said version 7 talons do not work to the specs identified by cobra and you need to use ver 8. Wish I knew that before my show. There are 2 black sky portions of my show from last 4th and that is when the strobes were supposed to fire. I let it play out without hitting the step button both times because I knew there would be a good effect coming up pretty quick.

I have all version 8 for this year. 76 has eport strobes new for this year SE423

100% good on the firewire for the gerbs.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Yes, you mentioned that. That really sucks. Glad to hear the gerbs fired though. Using initiators to light visco seems hit and miss. Good to know it worked well in your case. I think I'm going to reengage with SO76 and see if I can get some strobes with the eports. I think that's the way to go. I have a batch of talons from last year and a new order for this year. No idea what version they are. (Didn't know there was such a thing!) So I'm going to have to look into that. Don't need any misfires this year.

Thanks again for all the info Ed!! I really appreciate it.

[esgrillo]

I never use initiators to light visco. I always use talons. The gerbs have ports.

[esgrillo]

old ver 7 talons are fine if you are shooting 4 or less cues so unless you are doing more than that I would not worry about it. The version # is stamped on the black plastic portion of the talon.

[esgrillo]

old ver 7 talons are fine if you are shooting 4 or less cues so unless you are doing more than that I would not worry about it. The version # is stamped on the black plastic portion of the talon.

I meant less than 4 :)

[Rick_In_Tampa]

old ver 7 talons are fine if you are shooting 4 or less cues so unless you are doing more than that I would not worry about it. The version # is stamped on the black plastic portion of the talon.

Crap... Everything I just bought is series 7.

Oh well. I have enough initiators to fire everything this year anyway.

[cptnding]

Lol... OMG. Now that is a great idea!! I'm using strobes for the first time this year. I was concerned about gluing them down. I think I might just use your metal stake trick. That will also allow me to spread them out more. Cool!!

Man I love this site. So many cool ideas... :cool:

I will be using strobes for the first time this year as well. Is there any need to glue them to boards? I wouldn't think they have any risk of tipping.

[cptnding]

Rick, they are solid, about 1.5 - 2 ft in ground. Talons on the strobes. However they did not fire, I think I mentioned earlier making sure you use only version 8 talons and not version 7. I had a 100% fail on 2 cues of my strobes during my last 4th show. There were 5 on each cue, LiPo module. All was wired good. Contacted Cobra and they said version 7 talons do not work to the specs identified by cobra and you need to use ver 8. Wish I knew that before my show. There are 2 black sky portions of my show from last 4th and that is when the strobes were supposed to fire. I let it play out without hitting the step button both times because I knew there would be a good effect coming up pretty quick.

I have all version 8 for this year. 76 has eport strobes new for this year SE423

100% good on the firewire for the gerbs.

If you have a script running on the Cobra and hit the STEP button does it jump to the next event?

[Northern Sky]

If you have a script running on the Cobra and hit the STEP button does it jump to the next event?

STEP will jump to and fire the next cue. If firing to music it will sound like a skip.

Cobra also has alternate cues that can be fired to fill black sky. Another way to prevent black sky is to fire two cakes at the same time from different positions. There will be a hole but the lead will probably be the only one that notices.

[cptnding]

STEP will jump to and fire the next cue. If firing to music it will sound like a skip.

Cobra also has alternate cues that can be fired to fill black sky. Another way to prevent black sky is to fire two cakes at the same time from different positions. There will be a hole but the lead will probably be the only one that notices.

Thanks! I didn't know that. I've used the alternate cues set up but never realized that the Step would jump to the next que while a script was running. That's good to know. If I'm unsure of timing on fountains or fused mortar racks that could be very useful.

[Northern Sky]

Happy to help.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

I will be using strobes for the first time this year as well. Is there any need to glue them to boards? I wouldn't think they have any risk of tipping.

I do my show in a grass retention pond. So I normally glue everything down to 2' x 8' boards. This year I'm going to use a Cobra system and I can spread out the show a bit. So I'm thinking about using stakes for the strobes and cakes.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Just wanted to give a shout out to Scott from Cobra. I was bored today and decided to upgrade my 18R2 and 18M's to the latest software version. Somehow I managed to foul it up and I killed my 18R2. It wouldn't do squat except go into sleep mode. After going off on an expletive laced rant, I sent Scott an e-mail asking for help. Within 5 min I got a response back!! Scott was able to talk me down off the ledge and we got the issue fixed quickly.

It's because of this kind of support that I am soooo happy I got the Cobra. Scott and his team absolutely rock!! I just wanted to pass that along in case anyone else was on the fence about which firing system to buy.

[esgrillo]

their customer service is exceptional.

[bohicarlp]

Agreed to the last two posts. I started ordering from them last November, and have the utmost respect for their customer service.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Stupid question time... Right now I have a script built that will only use 8 cues on my last firing mod to finish up my cakes. After that comes the finale.

The finale is going to be 236 mortars that will be split and wired together with visco. I will have 100 mortars on the left, 100 on the right, and a 36 shot fan rack in the center. The plan is to fire from the outside in towards the center. After the center fan rack goes up, I have a single 11 shot fan slice to sort of punctuate the show finale.

The mortar crates/rack will be fused with visco and lit with talons. The fan slice can take an e-match. My initial thought is to use a separate firing system to light the visco on the 3 mortar stations, and 1 e-match for the fan slice. My question to you folks is, since I have 10 free cues left on my last Cobra mod, should I just use the Cobra mod in talon mode to fire the remaining cakes AND the finale mortars? I know that might sound ridiculous, but this will be my first year using the Cobra. I certainly don't want to mess up the finale part of my show trying to mix and light e-match and visco off the same mod. I'm also concerned about my script and timing. As I understand it, when you put the Cobra in talon mode, it will fire each cue for 2 seconds. So do I need to account for that in my timing? I know the e-match will fire immediately, but will there be an additional 2 second delay between firing each cue that I need to factor in?

Appreciate any suggestions you might have.

[3 Fingers]

Hey Rick-
I would not mix talons and ematch on the same module. I'm sure Scott will chime in on this if he sees it.
If I remember right, I think firing a match in talon mode can create a short. Odds are it would fire the match, but I think there could be a short if there is another cue fired during the 2 second talon burst. I opted to not take the chance.

It seems like a waste of a module to use a separate firing system for the mortars and save the module for one effect....the fan slice in ematch mode, but that's exactly what I did a couple years ago and it worked. I would ask Scott about this before committing anything to a script.

The other thing you might consider is when it comes to the timing....your fused mortar racks will be VERY difficult to time.
I've been burned by that several times....thinking I had the timing of fused racks close. There are too many factors from fuse to shells.
For this reason, I don't including anything AFTER the fused finale racks in my script. I'm going to fire anything after the racks manually using the Cobra.

As I just learned from Scott last night, simply program your script so that the RETURN CHANNEL (The channel the R2 turns to once the script ends) lands on the module you want to fire manually and just hit the cue manually at the right time. For example, say you set Module #5 to ematch mode....set the RETURN CHANNEL to 5. If you wired the fan slice to Cue 1 on mod 5, then all you have to do when the racks are finishing up is hit the the Cue 1 button and it will fire immediately.

I'm not sure how to program that using Excel, but in Cobra Show Creator, there is a field in Script Attributes that says RETURN CHANNEL. I'm using that. In your case, I would not script the Fan Slice. As your racks are finishing, you can hit that slice manually and the timing will be much closer.

My 2 Cents. Good Luck with your first Cobra show! I'll never forget my first Cobra show....it was exhilarating!

[Pyro@Mach13]

I think firing a match in talon mode can create a short.

Short where? Once the match is fire the circuit is open. Nothing there to short... ??

[Rick_In_Tampa]

3 Fingers - Since I never used this thing before I want to keep it as simple as possible. So I programmed the mortars to last for 30 seconds. In reality they should all go up in about 10. So I'll have time to pause the script and then just hit the STEP button to fire the fan at the right time. That's the plan for now anyway.

Thanks for the input!!

[esgrillo]

Rick, you're not using an audiobox right? Pausing the script will stop the music.

[esgrillo]

Also firing a match in talon mode will not create a short. I do that all the time. Firewire

[3 Fingers]

Also firing a match in talon mode will not create a short. I do that all the time. Firewire

Email from Scott Smith: Question: Can I fire an ematch in talon mode without any problem? Answer: Yes, however on that module, I would make sure you have a 2 second delay between cues on that module only. This ensures a shorted cue wouldn't cause a subsequent cue to not fire if it becomes shorted.

[esgrillo]

3 Fingers, I asked Scott the same question couple years ago before I started mixing. I think the risk of a short always exists even with a talon only scenario I suppose. . I honestly cant think of a situation that a "short" would come into play in any ignitor. The circuit is either open or closed unless maybe you have the entire ignitor underwater, grounded somehow or... honestly dont know. When a talon fires half the time (or more) the wire melts and opens the circuit and it never affects the next cue. The firewires circuit always remains intact after firing and that does not cause a problem either on the next cur. Maybe if there is an internal issue with the 18m but I would have to imagine if that was the issue it would not matter what kind of ignitor was in there.

What you do need to watch out for in that 2 sec window is not to fire more talons or firewire than specs. Now that will cause a problem (unfortunately speaking from experience on that one)

[3 Fingers]

3 Fingers, I asked Scott the same question couple years ago before I started mixing. I think the risk of a short always exists even with a talon only scenario I suppose. . I honestly cant think of a situation that a "short" would come into play in any ignitor. The circuit is either open or closed unless maybe you have the entire ignitor underwater, grounded somehow or... honestly dont know. When a talon fires half the time (or more) the wire melts and opens the circuit and it never affects the next cue. The firewires circuit always remains intact after firing and that does not cause a problem either on the next cur. Maybe if there is an internal issue with the 18m but I would have to imagine if that was the issue it would not matter what kind of ignitor was in there.

What you do need to watch out for in that 2 sec window is not to fire more talons or firewire than specs. Now that will cause a problem (unfortunately speaking from experience on that one)

I think that's right....it's that 2 seconds during the pulse that is the danger zone, regardless of what's wired to it.