Single fuse failure - 8 minute show goes up in less than 1.5 minutes

[pyrofan4life]

Here's what happens when good shows go bad. No more single fuse shows for me.


https://youtu.be/gXJ6uHcVsMg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXJ6uHcVsMg&feature=youtu.be

[Pyromaha]

Your loss is our gain. Haha. Kidding. I can't imagine how upset I'd be if that happened to me. I stress before my show every year. Know what happened? Wrong fuse?

[pyrofan4life]

Couple of things were against me. I put too much product into much too tight of a space. I used metal foil tape to cover the fuses on my boards and I suspect they burned at a much faster rate. I tested my different types of fuse under the foil and found that they burned a few seconds faster (45" per second burned at 43 for example). I also believe that fire jumped multiple fuses essentially lighting the show from both ends. I'm still sick to my stomach. That was $1500 of wholesale fireworks that was wasted.

I had to work with a 12 x 8 floating platform on a private lake which was not an ideal shoot site. It's safe to say I won't attempt to put that much product out there again and my next show at my family's lake will be fired with a Cobra system.

Product Used - 78 1.75" cans, 37 500g cakes, 18 200g cakes, 9 13shot slice cakes, 10 mines

[djsmurf]

That is where a few cobra mods and an 18r2 would be your best friend. Any set-up pics? Sucks to see it all go so fast. Did you have room to fire from more the one position?

[pyrofan4life]

I was too busy working this year to take setup pics but I will gather them up from family members in the next couple of days. I put in 15 hours of work not including planning for a couple of months. I'm definitely purchasing a Cobra system. As a certified pyrotechnic operator I could not be more embarrassed. This was my first personal show since I got my license back in June. Luckily I have a shoot this weekend to help get my mind off of things.

I don't have the option of a 2nd firing station unfortunately. I only have access to two flat bottomed row boats and we frame them up as one platform.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

I was too busy working this year to take setup pics but I will gather them up from family members in the next couple of days. I put in 15 hours of work not including planning for a couple of months. I'm definitely purchasing a Cobra system. As a certified pyrotechnic operator I could not be more embarrassed. This was my first personal show since I got my license back in June. Luckily I have a shoot this weekend to help get my mind off of things.

I don't have the option of a 2nd firing station unfortunately. I only have access to two flat bottomed row boats and we frame them up as one platform.

Don't get yourself down man. Stuff happens that sometimes we just can't control. Any number of things could have caused that to happen. Get back in the saddle this weekend and try it again. I'm sure the next show will be great!

[pistolus]

Ouch, hopefully you learned from that experience. Good sky puke finale though!

[pyrofan4life]

Thanks for the encouragement Rick! This weekend's show will be electrically fired with a Pyromate system from a baseball field with much more room to work with. Saturday can't get here fast enough to get that bad taste out of my mouth.

[djsmurf]

I was too busy working this year to take setup pics but I will gather them up from family members in the next couple of days. I put in 15 hours of work not including planning for a couple of months. I'm definitely purchasing a Cobra system. As a certified pyrotechnic operator I could not be more embarrassed. This was my first personal show since I got my license back in June. Luckily I have a shoot this weekend to help get my mind off of things.

I don't have the option of a 2nd firing station unfortunately. I only have access to two flat bottomed row boats and we frame them up as one platform.

Yeah don't beat yourself up, it happens. I have never done a single fuse show so I don't know the setup. I watched some video of them being set-up but that is all. Where are you from? Good luck with your show this weekend, hope it goes well.

[pyrofan4life]

Here's another view that shows the firing platform, however the video is terrible. I had to grab it from Facebook to post on Youtube. I'm waiting for drone footage from one of the neighbors at the lake site.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q68y9RowHOE&feature=youtu.be

[pyrofan4life]

Yeah don't beat yourself up, it happens. I have never done a single fuse show so I don't know the setup. I watched some video of them being set-up but that is all. Where are you from? Good luck with your show this weekend, hope it goes well.

Im in Charlotte, NC. My shoot site is in WV.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Thanks for the encouragement Rick! This weekend's show will be electrically fired with a Pyromate system from a baseball field with much more room to work with. Saturday can't get here fast enough to get that bad taste out of my mouth.

I feel your pain man. Been there, done that. This time last year I was one pissed off Jose. Just takes one good shoot to make that go away. Took me a whole year. You will be back on your feet this weekend for sure!!

[chriskrc]

We all feel your pain, that happened to me last year. The show was supposed to be 15 to 20 minutes but was done in 10. Things happen but have a great shoot this weekend and don't get yourself down about it.

[yoshisbar]

as ron white would say "it was nice"

[pyrofan4life]

That is where a few cobra mods and an 18r2 would be your best friend. Any set-up pics? Sucks to see it all go so fast. Did you have room to fire from more the one position?

I'm waiting for my new Cobra 54 que system to arrive on Monday. Should have bit the bullet a long time ago.
Here are some setup pics...
1218
1217
1219

[BLACKOMI]

Sorry that happened to you, personally at that level of product you have to use a firing system one fuse is just to risky. I do it but only for a 4-6 minute finale valued at 120 or so bucks I'm no where near your levels yet. Better luck next year and don't let it get you too down.

[Crab107]

I gotta say it bro..it looked pretty freakin cool..massive. i wouldve loved to have seen it in person. Same thing happened to me but on a much smaller scale. Had my 25 shot milk crate rack loaded with 3 different shot to be lit at 3 different times..the fuses jumped and it all went up in a few seconds..i was like AWE NOOOO DAMNIT!!! but all my family and freinds were cheering and clapping..they had no clue. Then on my finale' 2 of my cakes didnt fire and i only had 3..lol...i feel ya brother..for sure. But it looked real cool on the video. If it had been mine you wouldve heard a ton of language

[Rick_In_Tampa]

I gotta say it bro..it looked pretty freakin cool..massive. i wouldve loved to have seen it in person. Same thing happened to me but on a much smaller scale. Had my 25 shot milk crate rack loaded with 3 different shot to be lit at 3 different times..the fuses jumped and it all went up in a few seconds..i was like AWE NOOOO DAMNIT!!! but all my family and freinds were cheering and clapping..they had no clue. Then on my finale' 2 of my cakes didnt fire and i only had 3..lol...i feel ya brother..for sure. But it looked real cool on the video. If it had been mine you wouldve heard a ton of language

For what it's worth.. This year I zip tied AND used Dave's magic tape to secure every connection, and everything went up as planned. Didn't have a single cake not fire or single mortar left in the tubes this year. So I think I've finally cracked the code on that!

I'm going to order another 100 DR-11 tubes for next year, and maybe another 36 shot rack to add to the finale. Hopefully some of Dave's sponsors have some after the 4th deals. :)

[displayfireworks1]

Thanks for sharing your experience and videos. That long fuse thing just never works properly in a confined shoot location like a floating platform. May be time to consider electrical firing

[pyrofan4life]

Thanks for sharing your experience and videos. That long fuse thing just never works properly in a confined shoot location like a floating platform. May be time to consider electrical firing

LOL, I purchased a 3mod Cobra R2 system the week after that debacle.

[PyroManiacs]

I dont care what anyone says, that was awesome! Watched it twice!

[pyrofan4life]

Thanks. You could actually feel them going off which is something I've never accomplished with 1.4g at that distance. It was a spectacle!

[PYRODAN]

It still looked good. I use to do the one fuse set up with pretty good results. This was my first year with a Cobra system. 18R with 3 mods. I had 6 out of 100 cakes not go, witch I was basically happy with as it was my first time using electronic firing. After the show I found out what I had done wrong. I made a last minuet change after 3 months of planning as I was running behind on my set up time and well..... live and learn. If I can figure out how to post the video I will.

1285

[pyrofan4life]

It still looked good. I use to do the one fuse set up with pretty good results. This was my first year with a Cobra system. 18R with 3 mods. I had 6 out of 100 cakes not go, witch I was basically happy with as it was my first time using electronic firing. After the show I found out what I had done wrong. I made a last minuet change after 3 months of planning as I was running behind on my set up time and well..... live and learn. If I can figure out how to post the video I will.

1285

Looks like a nice firing platform. How big is it? Would love to see your show if you can post a link.

Regards,
Chris (PyroFan4Life)

[PYRODAN]

16' x 16' floating dock. On my friends 3 acre pond. 15 acre lot. We are going to build another one for next year. Hopefully I will have my type 54 by then and load it up with 1.3 cakes and 3" mortars.

[Pyro Paul]

I agree, nice set up. The fuse thing is just too unpredictable no matter if you think you've cracked the code or not. Just wait till you order that next round of fuse and it goes from great to oh shit!! I'll still use the fuse to chain cakes and mortars but I'm going with the cobra. I'm saving up for the scripted remote right now, the modules can come later.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

It still looked good. I use to do the one fuse set up with pretty good results. This was my first year with a Cobra system. 18R with 3 mods. I had 6 out of 100 cakes not go, witch I was basically happy with as it was my first time using electronic firing. After the show I found out what I had done wrong. I made a last minuet change after 3 months of planning as I was running behind on my set up time and well..... live and learn. If I can figure out how to post the video I will.

1285

Since this was your first time using the Cobra system, can I ask you what type of ematch you used? Was it the "consumer" version or the "real" stuff you can buy if you have a 54?

Also, how difficult (or easy) did you find the setup to be? I assume you had 3 mods because you had 3 cakes going off at the same time yes? How did all that work for you?

I'm looking at getting the same system next year is why I ask, and I don't have a 54 yet. So I'm likely going to have to use the "consumer" ematch.

[PYRODAN]

I used the Fire wire initiators. I did use 3 mods. However at some parts of the show I had 4 cakes going off at once one cue. I did this by wiring them in series witch works fine. Were I ran into a problem was as I was running out of time, some of the last cues I wired 4 in parallel to save a little time. WRONG! I could swear it said on the MJG website that 4 in parallel was OK. On the 4th I got an email from Cobra saying no more than 2 in parallel. (I dint read the email till the 5th.) It took longer to set up than i thought, and a strong chance of rain kept me from doing a lot of prep work ahead of time as I did not want to have to break down a bunch of stuff in case of a rain out. As it was we had to stop the set up twice and tarp everything due to rain. However, the Pyro Gods smiled and gave me good weather about an hour before shoot time. I really like the cobra system. Next year I am going to buy the 18r2 remote and 3 more mods so I can have more control over the mortars. I did find that when you put the initiators in z type cakes, its easier to pull the shroud back and just put the match head in carefully in due to the small size of the tubes.

[pyrofan4life]

Since this was your first time using the Cobra system, can I ask you what type of ematch you used? Was it the "consumer" version or the "real" stuff you can buy if you have a 54?

Also, how difficult (or easy) did you find the setup to be? I assume you had 3 mods because you had 3 cakes going off at the same time yes? How did all that work for you?

I'm looking at getting the same system next year is why I ask, and I don't have a 54 yet. So I'm likely going to have to use the "consumer" ematch.

Rick, since I got my Cobra system right after the 4th I've tested with both E-match and Talons. While E-match is the better option, the Talons will work. The downside is you can't fire as many Talon's concurrently and the ignition time is a little slower. I'm working around that by replacing the visco fuse with a much faster fuse (1/4-1/2 seconds per foot). Here's a video of my first test with my Cobra and Talons - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6PcGqUwIlik

[PYRODAN]

Apparently my video file is too large to post. I am trying to compress it. I really need to get better at this kind of stuff.

[pyrofan4life]

Apparently my video file is too large to post. I am trying to compress it. I really need to get better at this kind of stuff.

Whats the format (file extension) and file size?

[PYRODAN]

mp4 1.29gb. it was taken on a cell phone. and its sideways, lol.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

I used the Fire wire initiators. I did use 3 mods. However at some parts of the show I had 4 cakes going off at once one cue. I did this by wiring them in series witch works fine. Were I ran into a problem was as I was running out of time, some of the last cues I wired 4 in parallel to save a little time. WRONG! I could swear it said on the MJG website that 4 in parallel was OK. On the 4th I got an email from Cobra saying no more than 2 in parallel. (I dint read the email till the 5th.)

Well that's interesting because this is copied and pasted from the Cobra website:

Max E-matches / igniter clips per cue:....# feet wire*..........max series...max parallel*
.................................................. ............50....................10.............. ..4
.................................................. ...........100.....................9.............. ..3
.................................................. ...........250.....................8.............. ..3
.................................................. ...........500.....................6.............. ..2



So either they gave you bad information; they have bad information on their website; of they assumed you were using more than 500' of wire on the cues that failed.

I saw Dave's video on the newer firewire initiators and they seem to have much more material on the tips and provide a better "pop" than the older variety. That gives me a warm fuzzy if I invest in the Cobra system without having a 54 to buy the "real' ematch.

One tip for the rain issue. Something I never thought of until I we did it at a shoot last week. We squibbed the cakes and then wrapped each cake in a garbage bag in case it rained. Obviously, the wire wouldn't be affected by the rain and the firing module is in a waterproof case. So (in theory) you should be able to fire your show in a hurricane.

Here's a pic so you see what I'm talking about:

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=1297&stc=1

All of the bags burned up as the cake fired. So there wasn't any big mess to cleanup. Food for thought for next year...

[Rick_In_Tampa]

If I can figure out how to post the video I will.

1285

Stupid question.... Have you tried creating a You Tube site, uploading it there, and posting the link on here?

That's what I did and it seemed to work okay after I worked through some growing pains. I just posted a vid that's over 2GB and it worked just fine.

As for the sideways thing... Wish I could help with that one. I'm guessing it was an IPhone video, right? I still can't remember how you hold the damn thing to make it show up straight. Very aggravating....

[PYRODAN]

Ok, I'm uploading to u tube. Wow, 2 hours to upload! This is my first video on u tube. Is this normal?

[PYRODAN]

https://youtu.be/mlXv8pJ3PFM OK here it is. I think...

[ilovecrackle]

Ok, I'm uploading to u tube. Wow, 2 hours to upload! This is my first video on u tube. Is this normal?

It Depends on the size of the file you are uploading and your upload speed through your Internet provider.
One thing to keep in mind is your upload speed is almost always a lot slower than your download speed.

I have uploaded quite a few videos before totaling at least a few GB in size and they took quite a while.
I just went to bed and they were done when i woke up. :p

[PYRODAN]

lol, I will follow your advise in the future. Btw, love your avatar ilovecrackle.

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Ok, I'm uploading to u tube. Wow, 2 hours to upload! This is my first video on u tube. Is this normal?

Not sure what your bandwidth is with your ISP, but for a 1.2GB file, it's going to take a little time, yes. I'm guessing it's not an MP4 file, right? Last year one segment of my show video was 22 min and it was 2.6GB because it was recorded in some format I never heard of. This year my entire 42 min show was in MP4 format and it was something like 450MB. Don't ask me how I changed from one format to the other because I have no idea. The only thing I did different this year was shoot it in "fireworks" mode so the video was clear.

This was my first experience using You Tube too, and I found the experience to be quite aggravating. But a lot of it was self induced. I created my channel while I had my VPN going and it thought I was connected from Israel. So now when I try to upload a video, if I'm not connected to the VPN from Israel, the video won't even show up on the channel. Crazy....

Just stick with it. You'll figure it out.

[pyrofan4life]

Well that's interesting because this is copied and pasted from the Cobra website:

Max E-matches / igniter clips per cue:....# feet wire*..........max series...max parallel*
.................................................. ............50....................10.............. ..4
.................................................. ...........100.....................9.............. ..3
.................................................. ...........250.....................8.............. ..3
.................................................. ...........500.....................6.............. ..2



So either they gave you bad information; they have bad information on their website; of they assumed you were using more than 500' of wire on the cues that failed.

I saw Dave's video on the newer firewire initiators and they seem to have much more material on the tips and provide a better "pop" than the older variety. That gives me a warm fuzzy if I invest in the Cobra system without having a 54 to buy the "real' ematch.

One tip for the rain issue. Something I never thought of until I we did it at a shoot last week. We squibbed the cakes and then wrapped each cake in a garbage bag in case it rained. Obviously, the wire wouldn't be affected by the rain and the firing module is in a waterproof case. So (in theory) you should be able to fire your show in a hurricane.

Here's a pic so you see what I'm talking about:

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=1297&stc=1

All of the bags burned up as the cake fired. So there wasn't any big mess to cleanup. Food for thought for next year...

Excellent idea to use garbage bags to wrap the cakes. We always wrap cakes to mitigate threat of moisture seepage from the ground or air. At my last shoot we experienced a torrential down pour from a bad thunderstorm. Out of roughly 36 cakes, we lost 3 due to water damage as a river of water passed through our positions on the asphalt.

The sound stage manager at the event didn't prepare for rain. The sound stage got wet, the bands refused to play, and they shut the event down at 7pm on a Saturday night. We packed up everything but the finale racks and got permission from the AHJ to torch the finale. He made us wait for an additional 40 minutes to allow his "folks" to get to a viewing position - all for a 5 second burst of color and salutes. Anyone else have interesting stories to share about their local AHJ's?

[displayfireworks1]

Remember if you are using a fireworks firing system and electric match you can fire right through the plastic bags in the rain if you need to. There is no need to remove the bags. also on 1.3 fireworks, leave the cake in the box it came in , this will give it added protect from the wet ground.

[Pyro Paul]

Speaking of AHJ's... Has anyone in here from a small town had to find out who theirs was? I'm in a small farm town and even though there is a fire dept in town it's for a township 10 miles away. I'm guessing the AHJ is probably the mayor but I have no clue where to start. Does a person just go to city hall and ask to see the mayor? If anyone knows the solution to this puzzle I would appreciate any insight I can get before I start the chase. I just want to get to know the person and explain what my plans are and see how "strict" they may or may not be. A fireworks permit will probably be a first for this town since I am known for my consumer firework shows... 1.3 may scare them :confused:

[Rick_In_Tampa]

Speaking of AHJ's... Has anyone in here from a small town had to find out who theirs was? I'm in a small farm town and even though there is a fire dept in town it's for a township 10 miles away. I'm guessing the AHJ is probably the mayor but I have no clue where to start. Does a person just go to city hall and ask to see the mayor? If anyone knows the solution to this puzzle I would appreciate any insight I can get before I start the chase. I just want to get to know the person and explain what my plans are and see how "strict" they may or may not be. A fireworks permit will probably be a first for this town since I am known for my consumer firework shows... 1.3 may scare them :confused:

I would start with the local fire department you mentioned. They may not service your town (which is really odd) but they *should* be able to tell you who does, and from there you should be able to get your point of contact.