Atf Licence/ letter

[RetroPyro101]

In October i went to a pyrotechnics training course at the Zambelli fireworks plant in New Castle, PA. I received 4 of these same letters in the mail can anyone tell me about it or give me any information on it? Any info would help.

I am also looking to get my ATF licence and i need some information on what a contingency plan is and how i would go about getting one.

[Shootingstar_pyro86]

Yes. It clears you to use explosives under that company's permit for that company only. If you worked for another company you would fill out the same paper work and get the same type of letter but only for the other company. Look into getting Davis DVD on how to get your type 54.

[PyroJoeNEPA]

In October i went to a pyrotechnics training course at the Zambelli fireworks plant in New Castle, PA. I received 4 of these same letters in the mail can anyone tell me about it or give me any information on it? Any info would help.
If you look closely at them, you will see that the license numbers on each one is different. They sent you one of each so you are covered under all their licensing.

[displayfireworks1]

Those are "Employee Possessor" clearances. The reason you received four of them is because Zambelli has at least four difference divisions. If you read them closely you will see subtle differences. I know one is at least manufacturing etc. This is probably for the different ATF licenses they possess. Another reason may be a legal thing, if one sections gets into a legal situation they can continue business in another. Everyone that comes into contact with 1.3 or any explosive has to be processed through this clearance. This letter means the ATF ran a security clearance on you and you checked out OK. Even though I have my own ATF license/permit I receive these same clearances in the mail from every fireworks company I work for. I sometimes receive them from fireworks companies I do not work for. Does this clearance letter mean you can purchase 1.3 fireworks? The answer is no. Does this letter mean you will pass a security clearance if you apply for your own ATF license/permit? The answer is yes. When I shoot a professional for profit fireworks display for a company and hire a helper, they have to complete an "Employee Possessor" form. When I turn in my paperwork from the shoot I also include the completed form for the new person. Most companies will not issue a paycheck unless you complete this form. If I remember this correctly the ATF allows someone to at least start to work around explosives as long as they complete the form for pending final approval.
What about a private not for profit free display and you want to help. While I can not sign you on my license as an "Employee Possessor" because you are not working for profit I am still supposed to make sure you are not a person who should not be around explosives. If I am not paying you as an employee and have you complete the "Employee Possessor" form, I can be in trouble for calling you an employee and you are not. That is why I will at least ask someone new if they have a criminal record other than a traffic ticket. The ATF has never given me a clear answer on what type of charges will exempt someone from clearance, I would venture to say the charges are similar to those that would prevent you from purchasing a handgun in most states.
Does having this clearance letter make it any easier for you to get your own ATF license? The answer is no, while showing this letter to an ATF Inspector or including a copy of it with your application may help answer some questions why you want to purchase your own fireworks, it does not guarantee or grant you your own license.
It is common for people that receive these clearance letters to feel they have been granted some permission to buy something on their own. While the letter looks real official, it grants you permission to unload the truck or drive the truck with fireworks in it. And that is basically all it does.
If you want your own license/permit to purchase 1.3 fireworks and need my help please consider my ATF/DVD package. The proceeds help me keep the lights on so to speak.
http://www.pyrotalk.com/shopping.php

[RetroPyro101]

Thanks Dave for the info, you basically answered every question i had. I will consider your DVD package because i am definitely ready to buy 1.3 product. I will most likely buy it tomorrow lol. And hey keep me in mind when you need people for shoots.

[RetroPyro101]

On the application for my licence question 13 is "Is a state or local licence or permit required for explosive business and/or operations" it has the option to check yes or no. I know in Ohio there is an exhibitors licence the is required. What would be the best answer to put of this question?

[CTPYRO]

On the application for my licence question 13 is "Is a state or local licence or permit required for explosive business and/or operations" it has the option to check yes or no. I know in Ohio there is an exhibitors licence the is required. What would be the best answer to put of this question?

I answered no on mine for a few reasons.

1. it's asking for date and # - hard to give a date when you are not able to privide one
2. I'm not shooting in the state of CT either

Now yes you need a permit to shoot it for the most part but a state license should not have any effect on the 54 because it's only a license to purchase/store 1.3 only. I had told my agent I was going for my state shooters license because we were on the topic of display companies

[mguerra]

If a license is required you must answer "Yes". If you do not yet have that license, attach an addendum to the application stating that you are in the process of acquiring that state license. That is what I did in Texas. The ATF agent asked to see my paperwork for the state license application, saw that it was in order and underway, and approved me. Simple.

[Fire Art]

If you need help with contingency storage we offer it to our customers, feel free to contact me. I can get you a letter from us and ACE Pyro since you are in between both of our facilities.

[RetroPyro101]

I answered no on mine for a few reasons.

1. it's asking for date and # - hard to give a date when you are not able to privide one
2. I'm not shooting in the state of CT either

Now yes you need a permit to shoot it for the most part but a state license should not have any effect on the 54 because it's only a license to purchase/store 1.3 only. I had told my agent I was going for my state shooters license because we were on the topic of display companies

i agree with u CTPYRO
The ATF regulates the sale and storage of display fireworks. I believe that i would put no because i would be not in commerce. But i plan on working for Zambelli Fireworks. I am very torn between what to put here because i know for a fact that i don't have to have this state licence to get a type 54 licence.

[mguerra]

13. Is a State or local license or permit required for explosive business and/or operations? (If yes, provide license/permit numbers;if applied for
license/permit but not yet obtained, provide date of application.) Yes/Numbers or Date No

They are asking you a yes or no question. If you need an Ohio state license for "operations" then your answer is yes. You said that Ohio does require a license. Therefore your answer is yes. Get your application in for the Ohio state license if you have not done so already. They specifically say that if you do not yet have the state license, to provide the date that you applied for it. This is very simple. If you need clarification, call the ATF and ask them. Now, if all you plan to do is grunt work for a display company and not be a shooter, you can answer no. But in that case you do not need an ATF license! I presume you do not plan to purchase and store 1.3 G fireworks just to stare at them in the magazine, you plan to SHOOT!

[RetroPyro101]

Instructions:
1. Applications must be typed or neatly printed. Indicate type of exhibitor's license(s) applying for.
2. Payment of $50.00 per type of exhibitor license is required. Submit a check or money order made payable to: Treasurer,
State of Ohio. Application fees are non-refundable.
3. There is an additional $24 fee if fingerprinted by the State Fire Marshal's office.
3. Submit a letter of proficiency in the handling/discharging of product for exam type applying for (i.e. Type I must have
firework and pyrotechnic experience). The letter(s) shall be endorsed with the signature of an Ohio licensed exhibitor,
manufacturer or wholesaler of fireworks in Ohio, or a copy of a valid exhibitor license issued by another state.
4. Applicant cannot be convicted of, or have pleaded guilty to, a felony under the laws of this state, another state or the
United States of America. The applicant will need to submit an additional $24 for fingerprinting services provided by this
office. Your social security number is required on the application.
5. All applicants must complete and return Declaration Regarding Material Assistance form.
6. Applicant must be 21 years of age to sit for examination.

These are the instructions on the Application for Exhibitors License they are bullshit and finding out this information just makes me not wanna get my type 54. Why do they gotta make it so difficult

[CTPYRO]

While I agree that it seems there can be more hoops to go around regarding the 54 I had checked off no when I sent my app in back in December. When I first applied a few years back here in CT I remember the lady from the ATF saying I had to have 10 display shoots under my belt. That is if your going to be a lead shooter here in CT which yea I'm taking the test because I wanna get my own shoots for the company I work for. Now some states might be different regarding requirements to discharge 1.3.. I.E permits.... licensing. I will agree that it's important to get some kind of training first hand with 1.3 with a club or a display company. But contact the local ATF to get a clear answer on question 13

[RetroPyro101]

I thought this process was going to be easier when i first started now i kinda feel like its not worth it :/

[CTPYRO]

The process is not really too difficult. Many people have been in your shoe's. Apply for the license. Send it in. Make sure you have your contingency letter attached

[RetroPyro101]

ya but if i have to get an exhibitors licence and i check no on the application then wont it get denied?

[mguerra]

It is not that hard, you just have to jump through each hoop. You can do it. Go to your local PD or Sheriffs office and get fingerprinted, save the $24.00. Find a display company that will let you assist and train with them, so they can give you that letter of proficiency. That is easier than here in Texas, you HAVE to be signed off on 5 commercial shows. But that isn't even that hard! I don't know what #5 is, just find out and do it. In a few simple steps you will get your Ohio license. The ATF license is not difficult either, again, just jump through each hoop til your done. You will have to study to pass the state test, find out from Ohio WHAT to study. Most likely a version of NFPA 1123. I was able to complete all the state and federal requirements to get a Texas pyrotechnician license and federal ATF license in just a few months. It's just a matter of doing what is required.
If you want it, you will do it.
Most important, you are doing this to shoot 1.3 product. Be sure you are fully trained so you can do this safely and legally. Safely is the core of it. What may surprise you is what you are legally required to do to SHOOT 1.3 in Ohio. I have no idea, but here in Texas you need a seriously expensive ($5,000.00 per year) insurance policy. And a permit for every show. You might want to find out before you proceed, what Ohio requires for you to shoot the stuff! Now if you are going to be a shooter for a company, you don't need to worry about these things. But if your plan is to shoot your own private shows you need to know this stuff.

[CTPYRO]

Or join a PYRO club and you can shoot all the B you wish... get the contingency from the Club and use your 54 to make purchases for club shoots/shows

[RetroPyro101]

So should i get the licence from the state then go for my type 54?

[CTPYRO]

I think what he saying is at least get the ball rolling on that so that if the ATF questions it you can at least come back and say your going through the process. I think Dave mentioned this on another thread where someone was going for thier ATF and they said you needed a state shooters license. Ultimately the license has nothing to do with shooting it/only purchasing and storing it. Dave might be able to clearify this up more. I mean the state regs are a different story yes and the ATF will probably ask where you plan on discharging product.. they did prior to my face to face meeting which I was already prepared for

[RetroPyro101]

Ya thats what i thought they regulate the sale and storage not where it will be shot. I think i will check yes on the app for question 13 but explain that getting the type 54 is not dependent on if i have a licence with the state to shoot it. If and i hope that i will get approved. i plan on purchasing 1.3 in PA. I believe that there is no licences that are required in PA to shoot. Just a permit is needed.

[CTPYRO]

I believe your correct about PA.. I mean I know a few people out there that do not have a shooters license but have the ATF 54. And some TWP's are different in regards to getting permits. PA is a big state with alot of rural/farm thus why there are over 300 licenses out there

[RetroPyro101]

I will apply for my type 54 and see how that goes then deal with the licence that is needed in ohio later. If i do shoots with zambelli i know i am covered under there licences because i have done a show with them and i plan on doing alot more. i just wanna get my type 54 so when i go to open shoots and what not i can buy 1.3 stuff and not be stuck in 1.4 lol

[mguerra]

You only need to show the ATF you are in the process of getting your state license, you don't have to have it. However, if you would like to get the state license first, and then proceed to get the ATF license, that is perfectly fine. As it says in ATF question 13, regarding state licensure: "if applied for
license/permit but not yet obtained, provide date of application."
I applied for both my state and federal licenses at the same time to get it all done as quickly as possible. If you prefer to do them sequentially, that is your option. If perchance your plan is to do this for this years Fourth of July, you have plenty of time for the ATF license. The timeline for getting an Ohio state license is unknown to me. You might wish to enquire of the state agency that issues it. The State Fire Marshals Office issues it in Texas, and once you pass the written exam you get the license pronto. I will say again, irrespective of any licensing, you want to be trained in safe use of these explosives. If you take a course, perhaps a PGI course, and spend some time working with a display company, it will profit you greatly. You can become proficient quickly if you apply yourself diligently. I did see on youtube a series of instructional videos a display company has prepared for their employees. It can add to your body of knowledge, if you can find it.

[RetroPyro101]

I did take a course at Zambelli and i got a certificate of completion. i just cant wait for spring and summer because i want to do as much shows as possible and network with other pyros. Im excited to be a pyrotechnician because i have loved fireworks my while life. How did u go about getting licensed in Texas?

[PGH_Pyro]

just focus on the fireworks because some people along this road will try to dampen your enthusiasm .
you have a-holes in this hobby/field like any other .

[mguerra]

The Texas license is very straightforward. You have to have five sign offs that you worked a professional show. You have to take a 50 question test based on NFPA 1123, 1995 edition, and two sections of Texas state law on fireworks.

[RetroPyro101]

Just an update on getting my Type 54 i had my interview on Monday and it went very well. It only lasted half an hour, just went through the regulations and thats it. They said they were going to send it in then issue my licence.

[Engalwood]

Congrats RetroPryo101. Best of luck and BE SAFE!

[RetroPyro101]

Licence came in today, cant wait to make my first 1.3 purchase at Kellner's open shoot this weekend! :D

[Pyro Nation]

Well, hope they let you... They normally want a 2 week window for ordering

[displayfireworks1]

Congratulations on receiving your ATF Type 54. All the myths about needing a Ohio State Exhibitors license first have further been proven untrue. Get to a fax machine and sent your ATF license Kellner Fireworks Fax number is 814-786-7254. Wait one hour then call and explain your just received your license today and want to make a purchase of 1.3 to shoot at the demo. Pay for it with a credit card or similar payment ands they may pull it. Mention my name if you think it will help. Look me up on Thursday Night I would love to interview you and get you on video shooting something 1.3 if you are ok with that. Kellner will have mortars set up if you purchase shells.

[Pyro-Junkie]

I just faxed over my 54 and placed my first order with kellners on mon. They said it was no problem and i could add to it up to wed if i wanted. They dont have a lot in stock but you should be ok.
Btw congrats on the 54...see you there!

[RetroPyro101]

Ya that sounds good Dave. I did call them earlier i dident fax my licence over but the guy i talked to said i just need to bring my actual licence paper and my drivers licence and we would go from there. I told him i wanted a case of the 3" shell assortment so he took my name and phone number so im guessing it should be no problem if i just bring my licence in tommorow