exploding targets

[maliveline]

Hey guys. so basically tannerite is a binary explosive that explodes when you shoot it with a high powered rifle. You basically take a small pack of fine aluminum powder and mix it with the ammonium nitrate and when you shoot it with a high powered rifle it detonates.

my question is this, would this work with potassium perchlorate? That is could you take a small amount of fine aluminum powder and mix it with the oxidizer and then initiate it by shooting it with a rifle? any advice would be appreciated.

[displayfireworks1]

Tannerite swears that the people that sell the exploding targets that can be set off with a 22 caliber contain flash powder. The formula Tannerite sells can not be set off with a 22. With Tannerite you need a high powdered rifle. The advantage of Tannerite it is safer and legal to possess in unmixed package. The second one can set off pretty easily and is most likely illegal to make.
I knew a person that would hang up three inch display shell salutes and shoot them with a rifle, they go off nice. My sportsman club uses sidewalk chalk to give kids something to shoot at when teaching them how to shoot or when they have a contest. It gives a nice puff of smoke. I told them if they ever want to add a new level to the shoot let me know. They never did contact me. LOL The answer to the question is yes, flash aluminum mixtures will go off if you shoot them. If they do not you adjust the sensitivity. But as you adjust the sensitivity, you get closer to a possible accident. Most people that do this mix the smallest possible batch.
Since the ATF gave me a beaten years back, I do not make this type of video any longer.
Video from 2009

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyuypsMq-Kw
.
I was trying to find a video where this person shoots a reloadable consumer artillery shell and it goes off. I can't seem to find it.

[displayfireworks1]

Now you got me thinking about these exploding targets that are sold commercially. The 22 caliber ones in particular. I may purchase some for an experiment. After seeing this video and the behavior of the explosion. I would be willing to bet if you took this stuff for sale here, mixed it, and placed it in cardboard tube with a fuse , it would go off like a big flash firecracker. Tannerite will not go off with a fuse.
Here is the video, I am sure there are few others out there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_IHLtXXUds

[NWPA]

.22 cal. exploding targets were sold back in the 60's. About 1" in dia., 3/4" thick, bright orange top, sticky back. They were loud. They were not around to long as I recall. I was into competitive 3 gun bullseye shooting at that time and used them sometimes for something different. They were flash.

[maliveline]

I guess I'm just going to have to experiment. I know tannerite doesn't go off for a few reasons. But basically if you had fine powder ammonium nitrate and the correct stochiometric ratio of aluminum powder it would indeed behave like a flash powder.

I guess I'm trying to figure out if this concept will work with potassium perchlorate as in yes if you have the correct ratio of potassium perchlorate and aluminum it behaves like a flash powder. but if you had say a more coarse form of potassium perchlorate and a small amount of aluminum powder would it behave more like tannerite? The idea here is that potassium chlorate makes me nervous and I would like to do some good size charges. legally you can do up to 50 pounds but 50 pounds of highly sensitive flash powder is practically suicide.

I will say that here in Oregon they have been screwing with target shooters. Just this summer they closed down all the logging forests to target shooters. Now you are only allowed to shoot on government land assuming its not a state park, and I know in Colorado they banned people from using exploding targets on government land for fire danger reasons I guess. I don't think they have done this in Oregon "Yet" but if I go out to the woods in the rainy season and they say i'm going to start a fire i'm going to be pissed.

[maliveline]

actually I was reading around a little more and found that oregon bans exploding targets from like may to oct. which isn't too bad I guess. Washington I think has banned them outright as well as many other states.

[displayfireworks1]

I do not know if you saw my Blue Aluminum videos from few years ago, I was in communication with a person that was marketing explosive targets using the Blue Aluminum. The property of that aluminum behaved differently and was safer. He was selling these exploding targets at Flea Markets.
My Sportsman Club has a sign up "No Exploding Targets", this is typical around the country. Years back when I would shoot these occasionally, "Gun People" hate these and are fascinated by them at the same time. Tannerite told me he must have been in court one hundred times and spent a fortune in attorney fees fighting to keep these legal. He is starting to loose ground, last I talked with him at least one state outlawed these exploding targets. Social media is hurting the market on these. As we typical American do, once we set these off one at time a few times, we then go . lets mix ten of them together. then twenty and blow up an old car etc. I wish I could explain it but somehow these things send shock waves a long distance. In the video below, this was set off and it was not that loud , it send a shockwave through the air to someone's home and knocked pictures off the wall and the police were called. CNN, in a story about Tannerite took a clip from my video where I say "Its a Tannerite Bomb" and put a story together talking about the dangers of the legal product.
At the end of this video, you will see where the police show up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwygiTfsRAQ
.

[maliveline]

ya Its a bunch of crap. I guess I'm just grateful that here in oregon you can shoot them off in the winter time. thats when i'm usually bored anyway.

[pyropep]

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=796&stc=1http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=797&stc=1http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=796&stc=1


.22 cal. exploding targets were sold back in the 60's. About 1" in dia., 3/4" thick, bright orange top, sticky back. They were loud. They were not around to long as I recall. I was into competitive 3 gun bullseye shooting at that time and used them sometimes for something different. They were flash.
Are you referring to these little gems?
In my experience .22lr will set them off only if you het them dead center, now any .22 cal center fire or larger rifle/pistol will set them off if hit anywhere in the rings.
Yes they are very loud and will splinter telephone pole
I still have 2 full cases of them 12/10 to a case

[displayfireworks1]

I wish I had one of those targets you just posted. For experimental purposes I would stick a piece of Visco fuse in the bulls eye and light it. I am speculating these 22 sensitive targets are flash powder. I keep wanting to make a video about this and may do so soon.

[VintagePyro]

I've set off tannerite with a handgun. Not your average round since it does travel 2200ft/sec
http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=800&stc=1
Round on the right.
The thing with tannerite is you do need something with a high velocity to set it off. Usually .30 cal projectiles work best. I've hit tannerite targets shooting .223/5.56 and seen it just punch a hole in the container spilling it all over.
I've never used the rimfire reactive targets. We usually just buy ice packs on clearance and use those to mix for tannerite. Very inexpensive.....

[displayfireworks1]

For those new at this when he references "Ice Packs" he mean Ammonium Nitrate. Ice packs are Ammonium Nitrate and water. When the mixture of the two occur it produces a cold reaction. At one time I had a 50 lb. bag of ammonium nitrate. I kept it so long I eventually used it to fertilize my lawn. A year later someone I knew that actually had a ATF Manufacturing license ask me if I knew where he could obtain some. This is when I learned about shooting pyrotechnics with a bullet. He told me he was shooting 3 inch salute shells with a rifle and they explode. Back in the day I was fascinated with Ammonium Nitrate because I witness a person that was certified blaster or whatever they are called make a five inch aerial salute with ammonium nitrate. When it went off I thought he blew a hole in sky, it breathing to see and feel it. I tried to make something once but it never worked. Now all these years later I wonder if it is possible to purchase a 50 lb. bag of ammonium nitrate?

[Tropmoore75]

you can buy amonium nitrate from a few suppliers in the pittsburgh area in 25#,50# and 100#bags a 50# bag will cost you about 80 bucks, for 30 less bucks you can just buy a 5" ultra from LBS with your 54.

[jknepp1954]

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=796&stc=1http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=797&stc=1http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=796&stc=1


Are you referring to these little gems?
In my experience .22lr will set them off only if you het them dead center, now any .22 cal center fire or larger rifle/pistol will set them off if hit anywhere in the rings.
Yes they are very loud and will splinter telephone pole
I still have 2 full cases of them 12/10 to a case
Those look like the old Dapkus targets - we use to have them - but alas - all good things come to an end.
Like Dave - wished I could come across a few of those myself!

[maliveline]

Well I guess I’m resurrecting this thread. Anyone have any experience or success in this area? I’ve noticed that you used to be able to buy 20 pound bags of tannerite and now you can’t anymore because the atf has been cracking down and they don’t want people to be able to set off that much explosives even though it’s totally legal. I never had any real success in making my own exploding targets but I went out the other day and shot a mortar with an AR15 and it went off. I was pretty excited.
http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=3710&stc=1

[Kenny East]

I used to buy tannerite, but have since changed to making my own... 34-0-0 AN and 3% dark aluminum... If I intend to shoot it with a smaller or slower bullet I add 5% potassium perchlorate.

Potassium perchlorate added last and gently mixed by rotating my container... We usually use small water bottles like 8 oz size... Or a Ziploc bag as a container.

There are additives to increase sensitivity, such as antimony trisulfide, titanium sponge, and zirconium.... But most make for very sparky blasts or very dangerous mixtures.

You can still find the proper AN online in quantity.... But it won't come with the aluminum. A lot of cold packs are changing to urea or coated AN prills that won't work.

[Kenny East]

Back in the early 2000's we used to get 22 targets that were a 2" x2" .5" squares of black foam with cardboard front and back. .. They had about a teaspoon of what looked like flash.

Went back to get more and they were no longer made... Very sad they would destroy a cardboard box very well!

[OtisCampbell]

I recall the adhesive exploding targets were easily available and plentiful in the ‘80s at gun shows...

[cptnding]

I recall the adhesive exploding targets were easily available and plentiful in the ?80s at gun shows...

Oh yeah, me too.
In the late 80's you could get a case of them wholesale fairly reasonable cost per target. About a 2x2 square with a peel off adhesive on the back. One had a nice pop. Stack 4 or 5 on top of each other and BOOM! lol
Once we stacked 4 of them and taped it to the door of an old broken refrigerator. Shot it with a .22 and it blew a softball sized hole through the door and busted all the plastic on the inside. So what do we do next... Stack 12 of them in a 4x4 square and tape it to the freezer door on the top part of the old refrigerator. It blew the freezer door into several pieces, blew a hole through the back of it, and set it on fire lol. I had no idea until then how well an old fridge would burn. Lots of styrofoam insulation in there.
Ahhh the good old days! The best part was back then nobody cared. Clean up your mess and you're just young guys having some dumbass fun. These days you'd be considered a terrorist in training.

[DLux3888]

I guess I am reviving this thread again.

Has anybody had an success in using potassium perchlorate as the primary oxidizer for a .22 caliber sensitive target?

All the recipes I see are basically just flash powder, albeit mixed in a different ratio. As opposed to a 70/30 mixture for flash, I'm curious if the same ratio that Tannerite uses for the ammonium nitrate/aluminum rifle target would work with potassium perchlorate and aluminum as a rimfire target. Now, ammonium nitrate is pretty much impossible to get a hold of.

There are some ice packs that still use the ammonium nitrate and water recipe but they are getting harder and harder to find. Now most of the instant cold packs are urea and water, although I do see calcium ammonium nitrate fairly regularly and wonder if that would work.

[displayfireworks1]

I don't believe the regular Tannerite will go off with a 22 cal. You can make 22 targets as you stated. There may also be one using antimony and an oxidizer. Tannerite may also be selling a 22 sensitive target mix. Back in 2016 I did a video with a product I found in a sporting goods store. I believe the ATF or some other regulatory agency shut this company down. The ATF has regulation against selling firecracker kits. That was the topic of this video. I have the video unlisted , I'll play it here. Thus, whoever sells 22 target mix as a kit , better not sell a firecracker kit in disguise. Also as with Tannerite or any exploding target kit. Do not mix it and transport or mix it and store it unless you have an ATF license. You need to mix it at the range and shoot it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKeGmjvuU0M

[Arclight]

To add:

1. I bought some of those cardboard+styrofoam exploding targets many years ago at a gun show. They would definitely go off with a 22. I took one apart and it contained about 1/2 teaspoon of flash. They were LOUD.

2. In answer to your previous question, yes you can still but a 50lb sack of AN. They actually come 55lb/25kg to a bag now. I get mine at the same vendor that sells dynamite and ANFO. I think a bag is about $40. I believe some ag suppliers may sell it, but they will want a copy of your Type 20 license and will probably make you fill out some sort of "end use" statement.

3. Your AN mixture probably didn't work as well because you didn't have a booster. ANFO and other blasting agents require a cast booster or a stick of dynamite to detonate at full velocity. Tannerite will detonate but a bullet is a pretty weak primer and it's VOD (velocity of detonation) is pretty low.

[DLux3888]

To add:

1. I bought some of those cardboard+styrofoam exploding targets many years ago at a gun show. They would definitely go off with a 22. I took one apart and it contained about 1/2 teaspoon of flash. They were LOUD.

So does that mean that a simple 30/70 flash would be an ideal .22 reactive target? Interesting. I guess I've never even thought off shooting a mortar, but I was intrigued when previous commenters in this thread said they have done it and gotten them to go off.

Years ago when I had my Type 54 there were these little firecrackers called "tricorn crackers" and were just thick pieces of brown paper folded into a triangle with a tiny fuse sticking out. They weren't particularly powerful but I wonder if those would have been ideal reactive targets for a rimfire round.

[displayfireworks1]

So does that mean that a simple 30/70 flash would be an ideal .22 reactive target? Interesting. I guess I've never even thought off shooting a mortar, but I was intrigued when previous commenters in this thread said they have done it and gotten them to go off.

Years ago when I had my Type 54 there were these little firecrackers called "tricorn crackers" and were just thick pieces of brown paper folded into a triangle with a tiny fuse sticking out. They weren't particularly powerful but I wonder if those would have been ideal reactive targets for a rimfire round.

" So does that mean" . Stop theorizing and start making something and shooting at it. You will figure it out pretty quickly.

[Ctpyro180]

To add:

1. I bought some of those cardboard+styrofoam exploding targets many years ago at a gun show. They would definitely go off with a 22. I took one apart and it contained about 1/2 teaspoon of flash. They were LOUD.

2. In answer to your previous question, yes you can still but a 50lb sack of AN. They actually come 55lb/25kg to a bag now. I get mine at the same vendor that sells dynamite and ANFO. I think a bag is about $40. I believe some ag suppliers may sell it, but they will want a copy of your Type 20 license and will probably make you fill out some sort of "end use" statement.

3. Your AN mixture probably didn't work as well because you didn't have a booster. ANFO and other blasting agents require a cast booster or a stick of dynamite to detonate at full velocity. Tannerite will detonate but a bullet is a pretty weak primer and it's VOD (velocity of detonation) is pretty low.

My Dad , John Dapkus Invented the original exploding targets back in the early 1960. Later he re-designed the target in 1983 under the name Bullz-I Exploding Targets. Over 21 million were manufactured here at our facility in Durham, Ct . After 21 years of manufacturing and distributing them, BATFE pulled the exemption because of a freak accident with them... The last exploding targets were manufactured 15 years ago. These 2"X2"X1/2" Styrofoam targets with a orange Bullz-I were manufactured for both plinker with a bb gun right up to a professional with larger bore rifles. All you had to do is peel the adhesive paper on the back of the target and stick it on something you were going to shoot at and whamo...sounded like a M-80...Just a simple invention that made millions of target shooters happy ..

https://www.courant.com/news/connecticut/hc-xpm-1995-07-03-9507030348-story.html

[jknepp1954]

My Dad , John Dapkus Invented the original exploding targets back in the early 1960. Later he re-designed the target in 1983 under the name Bullz-I Exploding Targets. Over 21 million were manufactured here at our facility in Durham, Ct . After 21 years of manufacturing and distributing them, BATFE pulled the exemption because of a freak accident with them... The last exploding targets were manufactured 15 years ago. These 2"X2"X1/2" Styrofoam targets with a orange Bullz-I were manufactured for both plinker with a bb gun right up to a professional with larger bore rifles. All you had to do is peel the adhesive paper on the back of the target and stick it on something you were going to shoot at and whamo...sounded like a M-80...Just a simple invention that made millions of target shooters happy ..

https://www.courant.com/news/connecticut/hc-xpm-1995-07-03-9507030348-story.html

I remember those - bought some from you back in the day. I was trying to keep 1 pk just for me for collection - i hope i can find it.

[SITHADMIRAL]

we use 60/40 potassium perchlorate with antimony. pour into paper cups 1 inch diameter filled with aquarium gravel glue other half together. can be triggered with bb guns.

[Engineer Cat]

My Dad , John Dapkus Invented the original exploding targets back in the early 1960. Later he re-designed the target in 1983 under the name Bullz-I Exploding Targets. Over 21 million were manufactured here at our facility in Durham, Ct . After 21 years of manufacturing and distributing them, BATFE pulled the exemption because of a freak accident with them... The last exploding targets were manufactured 15 years ago. These 2"X2"X1/2" Styrofoam targets with a orange Bullz-I were manufactured for both plinker with a bb gun right up to a professional with larger bore rifles. All you had to do is peel the adhesive paper on the back of the target and stick it on something you were going to shoot at and whamo...sounded like a M-80...Just a simple invention that made millions of target shooters happy ..

https://www.courant.com/news/connecticut/hc-xpm-1995-07-03-9507030348-story.html

Very interesting. So you must be Guy. Can you tell us more about how the accident happened? Often when we talk about handling products safely we use "IT'S UNLIKLY to happen" but that doesn't mean it can't happen so I'm interested to know if it was something that would of been labeled as unlikely to happen.

Do you guys still manufacture fireworks or is it just a resale business now?